My question is about masturbation as i find is my weakest link, specially regarding the argument that masturbating thinking in women or with images of women is degrading to them by converting them into a sex object. Argument to  which i hypocritically agree. My questions are, is this argument reasonable? are there other ways to approach that action? Is there a proper rebuttal besides the slippery-slope of "If it is not with woman, guys will start looking for pictures of animals or ..."?

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 A proper rebuttal in my opinion would be to say, "I don't see an issue with gays masturbating to thoughts of other men, nor to images of such, no one sees gay porn as degrading men into sex objects. If a gay guy wants to masturbate to thoughts of me, I couldn't care less as long as I'm not in the room while he's doing it, I don't think this is in any way degrades the respect and friendship he shows to me, and neither do I think either my visual aids or my over-active imagination degrades the respect I hold and friendships I have forged with women."

It's hard to overestimate the extent to which old school feminism has convinced women that the default condition is that they are being victimized. Luckily, more recently, the younger feminists are reexamining that view and are drifting away from it,

Luckily indeed, I have been accused of being guilty of pretty much anything that a man ever did to a woman anywhere by these stuck up, humorless, sexist cunts. 

Any person anywhere who stands for equality has my support, though. "Yay!" for modern feminism/equalism, let's drop the baggage of the past and move forward.

If you think that equality can only be reached by ostracizing and demonizing roughly half of the earth's population you just might be a feminazi cunt, and I wouldn't piss on your ass if it were on fire.

No need to feel guilty for masturbating whatever you might fantasize about, Japanese porn is about the sickest stuff imaginable, yet Japanese rape figures are incredibly low.

Feeling guilty about your imagination is the surest way to frustration, frustration can lead to anger, which leads to hate and to suffering. Yoda was right after all. So, enjoy your body, enjoy your perverted mind and don't feel ashamed or guilty.

"A dirty mind is a joy forever!"

The original question however was about the opinions of religions and not of feminists.

I grew up in a relatively liberal country, and I know quite a few girls who watch porn, including one who regularly watches gay porn, once you remove the stigmas of religion and society, letting them make up their own minds on what they want to watch or do there really isn't too much difference between males and females.

I could say something here. But there is a new religion called "call any woman with an opinion a femnazi to shut her up"...

Since you have replied to other posts on TA, it does seem to be that this "religion" does not stop you from saying stuff. As such I think that this reply here is meant to show your frustration and anger (?) with the way in which people talk about feminism, without getting too much involved into the discussion.

Please let me be the first to say that I do not intend to group all feminists under the "feminazi" label, in fact very few of these actually exist, although they tend to be quite vocal, they are at least as far as I know a minority within the feminists. That does not stop me from sharing my anger and frustration at these people, though.

Anyway, if you feel like it, you can of course share your opinion, after all opinions are like assholes, we all have one. If you happen to disagree with people, perhaps others could learn from it. 

To me at least, at this moment, you come across as somebody who wants to say something without actually saying anything, as such you don't provide any real content to the discussion which makes it hard to engage with you in a (fruitful) talk/discussion/debate. That's a pity, since you apparently have a different opinion on the matter (?).

Also, nice strawman argument..... I'm pretty sure from reading other replies of you that you can do much better than this.

I have read through the opinions of several women on this thread and I haven't heard one called a "femnazi", although in my opinion the feminists argument on this subject died when different studies found between 30-80% of women watch porn depending on the demographics surveyed. But I'm always willing to reconsider my opinion to a well formulated argument, and I promise not to call you a femnazi...

I got halfway through the comments.... Boooring.... This dude just wants to jack off! Hey, Cesar, it's ok! You can even use my profile picture :) as you can see, the face is blank, so feel free to put any face you want there ;) it's ok to think of any woman(or man) while you do such a personal thing for yourself! The only exceptions(I know full well it is your mind, so ignore me if you want) would be family members and children. Because that's just gross. Happy stroking!

All I'm going to say to you is, masturbation is natural and harmless. You might be thinking of other women (or in my case men) while you are doing this. But really it is a one man act, it involves no one else but you and possibly some pornography (no harm in that either). 

The problem with this whole thing of saying "Well if you do that. Whats next? Masturbating to animals?"

Well basically its a copout argument. Beastility and masturbating to other adult human beings are totally unrelated. Fundamental religious persons use the same comparison on homosexuality in order to attempt to say why that isn't acceptable. Totally opposite concepts. 

This whole objectification thing baffles me to start with. To those who cling to this view, please order these from best to worst:

A man masturbating to...

Fantasies or pictures of his girlfriend when she isn't physically there

Some anonymous minor pornstar performing in a porn video

Some famous pornstar performing in a porn video

Katy Perry performing in a video wearing skin-tight outfit

What are men supposed to do with their sexual feelings? Bury them and instead work on their stamp collection?

It may have something got to do with the Pro-life movement which could be motivated by a passage in the book of Genesis about wasting seed

Genesis 38:9  

"But Onan knew that the offspring would not be his. So whenever he went in to his brother's wife he would waste the semen on the ground, so as not to give offspring to his brother"

It certainly is an uber-extreme version of Pro-life, but I have heard this argument before from them. 

And in answer to your question. The same thing they do with any other feeling in which contradicts their faith, they oppress it. Another of many reasons why I am against many religions. Its a danger to the mind. 

Well I am a lesbian, and I guess I am what most religously inclined Americans would consider a feminist but I have no problem with men or women thinking about me (i do have a good figure and am told a lovely bum!)as they masturbate if that is what they wish to do, as long as they keep the thoughts buried inside their head. I am certainly in no position to tell anyone not to masturbate when I consider it one of life's essentials and thoroughly enjoy the practice myself. In fact I would go so fat as to say that without it none of my four children would make it pass their toddler years, mama needs her little "unwinding habit" after they have spent the entire day day doing nothing but wind me up !

Human sexuality is amazing, sex is lovely, orgasms are good for you ( I am a physiologist, trust me they really are)so go and enjoy masturbation without guilt and never apologise for enjoying it. I never cease to amaze myself at just how enjoyable and varied the female orgasm can be, not sure you men have the same scope but perhaps that is something for another discussion.
Judith vd R.


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