Mom Tries to Kill Kids, Self, Before 'Tribulation' Comes

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Comment by Jason Ward on May 21, 2011 at 11:24pm
As a note Harold Campings website is still down.....Surprise?
Comment by Bruce Campbell on May 22, 2011 at 12:02am

A poor women suffering a mental disorder was able to hide in her suffering in her religious beliefs.

Whilst I'd like to say it's Harold's fault, I can't. What I can say is that Harold's rubbish has pushed a vulnerable person over the edge. Her daughters are paying the price, and will do for their entire lives.

Comment by jared huffman on May 22, 2011 at 12:52am
First it never says anything about her religious beliefs, it says she thought the world was coming to an end. Secondly, assuming she would say she was a Christian, that would not promote her to do anything like this it would tell her to do the exact opposite. If she did do this because of her religion it's obviously mixed with bad mental health and a very poor understanding of her beliefs. The problem with Christians a lot of times totally aside from her is that they don't really even know what the bible says about anythingg, they just repeat what they heard. I am one but I at least I take pride in knowing what I actually believe. All that said putting this woman's actions on religion I think is a stretch by far.
Comment by Heather Spoonheim on May 22, 2011 at 1:07am

Jared, I would beg to differ, although only to a certain degree.  As my own mother's mental state deteriorated she was able to evade the mandates of the mental health authority because her Christianity gave her plausible deniability.  Her beliefs were delusional and unfalsifiable but could not be legally declared a mental disorder because they fell within the bounds of her religion.  I was fortunate enough to be able to recognize her efforts to 'send me to god' by means of poison attempts and even more fortunate that I didn't have to finish growing up in her home.  I wanted her to get help, but I also faced the hurdle of going against the church, who believed her demonic visions to be prophetic.


I realize this doesn't represent Christianity in general at all, but you need to realize that as long as we are leaving people who believe in imaginary friends and foes out of the looney bin, the door to the asylum is left open.

Comment by jared huffman on May 22, 2011 at 1:53am
Sorry to hear about your situation, that sounds unbelievably horrible but I really don't have enough information really to respond to that fully. I'm not sure what you mean by believeing in imaginary friends and foes and the looney bin. Do you mean anyone who believes in a God and demons or Satan should be hospitalized because I would disagree with that. I don't know, I'm a Christian but I mean its obvious whatever church she was attending was out of control if they were encouraging her to hurt you, like I said I don't know enough to respond so I'll just say sorry that happened to you.
Comment by Heather Spoonheim on May 22, 2011 at 2:07am

I am saying that anyone who believes they are being instructed by an invisible man (a god) or demons should most definitely be in the looney bin.  Anyone claiming to be receiving instructions from such an entity is either a liar or a lunatic.  You've got guys like Harold Camping raking in millions by selling his lies (if he isn't lying then he has lost his sanity) and millions of people deluded by his ravings that prevent mental health authorities from acting, just in case a particular delusion is considered a valid unfalsifiable construct by a large segment of the population.  Even the fact that millions of fundamentalist Christians vote against their economic interests because they are told it is an abomination before their god if a gay couple should be allowed to get married and live in peace is a strong piece of evidence that the delusion is destructive.


I am quite indifferent to those with deistic beliefs that realize there are no supernatural powers communicating with us - but those who do believe this seriously need therapy.

Comment by Heather Spoonheim on May 22, 2011 at 2:37am
Joseph - I'll go so far as saying that those who believe that he exists and is watching are not necessarily crazy, because believing in something without evidence is not really that crazy - just foolish.  Believing that he is actually talking to you, however, means believing in something when the evidence is to the contrary, and that is crazy, no two ways about it.
Comment by Heather Spoonheim on May 22, 2011 at 3:16am
Well don't get me wrong, I think the whole concept is bonkers, but so is believing every single year that your team will win the cup.  We all have some unfounded and unfalsifiable beliefs, but for the most part we can understand why other people do not hold them as well.  Once a belief is falsifiable, however, and has been falsified, over and over and over - the refusal to accept that truth can constitute a mental illness where other symptomology corroborates the diagnosis.  Oddly, in the case of large congregations that stick to a firmly falsified belief, the diagnostic criteria actually have to include a caveat for mass delusions - even while they dance around babbling while believing themselves to be speaking in another language.
Comment by jared huffman on May 22, 2011 at 3:45am
So hypothetically speaking, if there were to be a god that actually did create everything that exists would you find it farfetched that that god would have the ability to communicate to the creatures that he created seeing that they have the ability of communication. Just a question of curiosity and logic not belief.
Comment by Heather Spoonheim on May 22, 2011 at 3:59am

I'm glad to consider hypotheticals - that's the power of philosophy.  If there were a super-being who created everything, down to the last details of the human form, I would think that super-being could do everything I could imagine as well as things I couldn't begin to imagine.  If that being had a message for human kind, it could easily make it readily clear - like imbuing the minds of the earliest people with whom it communicated with the knowledge of writing, maybe even handing them a pen.


If that sort of being intended any message to be conveyed but failed so miserably then one would have to assume that it was incompetent.  Furthermore, all subsequently perceived communications would have to be questioned, given the cosmic scale of that beings incompetence.  As it is, however, the evidence shows us that no such communication has occurred at all - unless the messages are intended as trickery to mislead us, in which case we are talking about a supernatural being that is the antithesis of a god; the word devil comes to mind.


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