Dan Savage discusses bible at High School Journalism convention

Dan Savage talks about the use of the bible to justify homophobia at a high school journalism conference. Offended christian students leave the room.

Comment by Mike on May 1, 2012 at 6:02am

OT God was a good kill em all Conservative, then he unleashed his commie lovey dovey Liberal son on the world.  That is why the conservatives always go running to the comfort of the old testament when arguing their points.  They are friendly loving Jesus following christians when they are dealing with their own, who think and feel the way they do.  As soon as there is any difference between how you live and how they think you should live then it's time to let loose the OT God, the one who knew how to do his job.  The good old days of smiting and genocide, back when god knew how to do his job.

Dan knew exactly what would happen when he brought this up.  He exposed these hypocritical morons for what they are.  They are so weak of faith that they couldn't stand to hear their beliefs challenged.  They know that thoughts, facts, discussions weaken a belief that has no standing so they left before they would have to think about what they believe.

Comment by Mabel on May 4, 2012 at 8:57pm

Awesome come backs to Christian poster John Holloway, earlier in this thread. I wish he would have hung on longer, instead of refuting just the first few posts. I would have liked to see what he had to say to refute all of them.

Comment by John Holloway on May 13, 2012 at 9:24pm

Sorry. I'm in college and I had to take a break from this for finals.

To be honest, there is a little too much to reply to here. I don't really know what to say. This will probably be my final reply. I knew I was coming as a sheep among wolves when I came to this site lol. I only do this so that some people might be spurred on to look more deeply into stuff like this, instead of just accepting ignorant statements as is. And sure, I don't claim full, perfect knowledge of the Bible. I am ignorant to things, of course. Some things I say could be wrong.

For slavery: I might have overlooked it, but I don't see a new argument. There are scriptures of how to behave if you are a slave. The Bible says enslavers are bad. Sure, people used the Bible to try to justify slavery. Martin Luther King Jr. used Christianity as a backbone for equality, did he not? 

For the people claiming that the OT Law does apply given verses like Matthew 5:17-20, you need to take a step back and look at what it is actually saying (and don't be so hostile, please). Jesus said He has not come to "abolish them but to fulfill them." Now take a second and think about that. Not abolishing, meaning they don't cease to exist, but fulfilling them, meaning they no longer need to be fulfilled. I don't see how this isn't clear. Jesus came to fulfill the law. He did. It is fulfilled. It does not need to be fulfilled any longer. Now some people have wrongly said that I think the entire OT does not apply and isn't worth reading or carrying or whatever. When I spoke of the OT not applying, I was talking about the OT Law. Yes, the OT is something I still read and I think is valuable. But I don't follow the OT Law, because it was fulfilled. I don't still go to grade school, because that requirement was filled. This is not some weird Christian sect's belief. This is basic Christianity.

@Jimmy Russell  For sure, people use the Bible to do bad things. For sure, people use the Bible to do bad things. Please understand that we come from completely different belief systems, different philosophies of life. Our definition of good and bad will be different. I would say that I am intolerant in some ways. For example, I think homosexuality is a sin. I don't think it is a good lifestyle. That doesn't mean I stand on soapboxes and angrily scream at people. That doesn't mean I demean my friends who are homosexual. It doesn't even mean that I think I am better than them. I love them as my friends and we get along just fine. You can say that "what the Bible teaches" is everyone's opinion, but I would disagree. Some things are definitely harder to know than others, but with study most is pretty apparent. 

@G. Micheal Williams  Education takes a quite a few words to combat ignorance... Were you making a point?

@Ron V.    I do live in 2012. I love science and all that jazz. I'm curious, do you think your belief system was created in 2012? So... will your belief system expire in 2000 years? Picture this: what if the Bible was truly inspired by God? Would it then expire? 

I apologize if I missed someone's post. I may or may not return. This is pretty time-consuming. I've done what I've done because I believe that you all have what it takes to look at this issue and see if Dan Savage was saying factual statements, or if he wasn't. It does take some effort to actually read the Bible and understand what it says. I have been studying it personally for years and I'm still learning things all the time. I'm simply trying to make it easier for you to see what it actually teaches. I am in no way an expert or a professional, but I don't think it takes one to refute what Mr. Savage is saying.

And for the record, people spouting hate in the name of God disgusts and depresses me. This is not what the Bible teaches.

Comment by kris feenstra on May 13, 2012 at 10:09pm

Now take a second and think about that. Not abolishing, meaning they don't cease to exist, but fulfilling them,meaning they no longer need to be fulfilled. I don't see how this isn't clear.

Well, I think where most people get confused by the issue that lines 19 and 20 say:

19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

Seems like a pretty unambiguous statement that he expects his audience to uphold the Law themselves.  The interpretation of 'fulfill' which you have provided seems unlikely.  Even if it was correct, that seems worse.  "Well, I know we said that stuff was moral back in the day, but I've taken care of it now so don't worry your pretty little heads.  Divine morality is malleable cool like that".

Comment by Anna on May 18, 2012 at 9:28am

YES YES YES

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