Comment by Nate Lundgren on October 30, 2012 at 1:12am

True Blaine, I see mormons as practitioners of "usually nice" magic. Catholic stuff seems like the dark arts of magic and death worship. But any way you look at any religion, it's based on nonsense and magical fantasy-based thinking. The most committed to religion seem to have overly inflated egos and a pretension of superiority of mind/correctness even if they are espousing total shit and propaganda. I'm so glad that I'm out of that mental torture chamber now. I will never have to sit through 3 hours of bullshit every Sunday and other long, boring, redundant church meetings ever again. I'm extremely grateful for that and many other freedoms of mind and body that I can enjoy now. My family has been part of the mormon church since those early days when Joseph Smith was persuading, tricking and lying to them and many others. I don't think any of my relatives were part of that massacre but I could be wrong since I haven't done a thorough examination of that time in history and I do have lots of relatives that lived in Utah during that time period. Anyway, thanks for the comments and I hope all is well. :)

Comment by Doug Reardon on October 30, 2012 at 1:41am

Yes, but the believers are a select few who are special in all of creation and will be rewarded for their  loyalty.  Hurrah for me!  You can suck eggs!   ...Geez, why does that sound so republican?

Comment by James Cox on October 30, 2012 at 2:34am

One question not yet addressed:

Nate, how did you find the exit from the church?

Comment by archaeopteryx on October 30, 2012 at 3:50am

I had a cousin Vinnie once, used to "take care" of people, for a price, until somebody took care of him, for free --

Comment by archaeopteryx on October 30, 2012 at 4:01am

Anybody happen to know Mitt Romney's "secret name"?

Comment by kOrsan on October 30, 2012 at 4:51am

Probably something like "rainbow in the dark"

Comment by Nate Lundgren on October 30, 2012 at 8:12pm

James, I found my exit through years of thinking and seriously examining my life and what was wrong with it. The answer always led back to the mormon church being a stumbling block to my happiness and having a healthy and happy life. So you could say it was an emotional de-conversion before it was one based on logic or reason.

But I do/did have a fairly analytical mind although I tended to do many things based on emotion even if it was not rational or good for me socially or economically. I still struggle with being a "reasonable" person but becoming an atheist cleared out the many cobwebs that had been building up over the years. So I'm kind of starting over from childhood in some ways and re-discovering what it means to be a human that doesn't rely on patriarchal authority figures, magical books and magical feelings to govern my life.

So the semi-short story so as not to bore you too much with every detail is that it was a process that happened over many years and culminated last year when I was so mentally and emotionally broken that I had literally curled up in a ball of isolation from the world at my parent's house after having quit my job in South Korea teaching English and I was nearly suicidal. I had to make a choice about my sanity and I heard a song on Youtube with a very simple title that changed my life. The song was called "Come Alive" and it is an instrumental so no lyrics. Anyway, that song gave me the message that I needed. The message basically being that religious-thinking nearly killed me and I needed to come alive as a free individual for basically the first time in my life.

My two older brothers have been atheists for many years and so that made it easier for me to tell my parents that I had become one as well. Of course they were more disappointed in me since I had been loyal to the church for so long.

They accepted it though and we have moved on in our relationship. My mom died a few months ago so I don't have her disappointed looks at me anymore. My dad will debate with me a little bit sometimes but we keep it in good fun usually and light-hearted most of the time.

I have made a fair amount of progress over the last year in taking better care of my health both mental and physical since I know now that this is my only life to live and I need to actually care about myself. I had truly hated myself for all those years as an "unworthy" creature of an apathetic (non-existent) but supposedly "loving" deity.

Now I just hate that I wasted so many years and opportunities in my life because of "faith." I'm getting better/recovering from the bitterness as well as real set-backs caused by my old ways of thinking. It certainly hasn't been easy but I feel so happy and strong since I feel like my integrity is intact and I can be exactly who I am with no excuses or unwarranted guilt.

I guess you may have not wanted such a long answer but that is the best way I can answer. Thanks for asking that question.   

Comment by James Cox on October 31, 2012 at 2:33am

Nate:

Sadly a life is not built upon sound bites, or text bites. Our science club in HS had a one liner, 'it seems to take an infinite number of terms to define a finite number of ideas'. I expect that this might be roughly equal to what is needed for a life.

We each start somewhere, and none of us are necessarily privilaged. I have only been out of the states once, but have traveled some when I was younger. Staying close to home, Oregon, has not always been helpful.

Hope your next moments are pleasing.

James

Comment by Nate Lundgren on November 3, 2012 at 7:27am

An addendum to this video: there is a ceremony before these that is called the "initiatory" and it requires the new person that is going to the temple for the first time to strip naked and put on a white robe/poncho-like cloth. The person then goes through the ceremony where they are "washed" and "anointed" to become a king and priest to the "most" high god. The ceremony is done in the male locker room area for men and in the female locker room area for the women since obviously being naked except for basically a sheet with a hole in it would not go over well with the "modesty" police in the church. The person doing the ceremony has to touch with fingers that have been dipped in olive oil under the sheet to "bless" areas of the body like the lungs, heart, kidneys, loins etc. They don't touch the genitals but fairly close with olive oil that is called consecrated oil meaning it has had the magical words of a "blessing" put on the oil.

Anyway, the first time I went to the temple I was 19 and very shy about my body since I was taught that it was wrong to show it off in any inappropriate ways. This ceremony felt like I was being molested since everything they did was without prior explanation and I had to just "trust" those doing the ceremony. Luckily, nothing kinky or of a sexual nature was actually done as part of this but I had no way of knowing what they would or wouldn't do as they were reaching under the sheet to "anoint" my body with oil and on my head and other areas as well. I didn't know where their hands were going to go. I have heard that the ceremony has been modified and people now keep their underwear on instead of being completely naked under the poncho/sheet with a hole in it. (like that makes it any less weird) I vividly remember this experience to this day and I suppose that is the point of an "initiation" type ceremony but I have felt much anger and some shame over the years for having gone through those experiences.

It is an extremely nerve-racking experience when someone goes to the "sacred" (secret) temple for their first time. You are horribly ill-prepared for it no matter how "faithful" or educated you may feel you are in scriptures or doctrines etc. and they do this on purpose. It is a kind of brainwashing technique that seems to have been around for a very long amount of time in many cultures and not just the LDS one. That in no way makes it good or justifiable. It is a way to scare loyalty into someone and keep them in the "in" group because it is something that only the "insiders" know about.

I just felt like sharing these experiences to give you a little more background into the level of control and submission that is required of "faithful" LDS members, also to purge myself of the fear that was pushed into my heart and mind. One phrase in the ceremonies that is really shitty is that they say "god will not be mocked" Well fuck them and I will mock god all day long now and whenever I feel like it. I'm a free human being and fuck those assholes in Salt Lake City that tried (but obviously failed) to indoctrinate me and control my whole life.

I embrace reality,science and logic with open arms now and truly cherish learning much better ways of thinking and understanding life from many different perspectives now. My brother put it in a nice way when he said that when he broke free from mormonism it was like he stepped out from a small cave he had been in his whole life up until then and discovered that there was a big wide open and beautiful world outside to explore. I think he is a smart brother and I agree with that sentiment and idea wholeheartedly. I will end by saying thanks to those that have forged their ways out of religion before me and showed me that although it can be dangerous and scary at times, reality is much better than fiction. :)

Comment by Nate Lundgren on November 3, 2012 at 7:35am

I just thought about why the guy that made these videos couldn't get the initiatory part since it would be impossible for him to keep a camera hidden since you are mostly naked during that ceremony. He would have had nowhere to hide the camera literally hahaha 

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