Well for starters, you never told me who Jesus is. You did not reply to my comment about all the hundreds of fulfilled prophecies in the OT about What Jesus would do and the precise time he would start his ministry. You ignored the point I made of scientific foreknowledge in the Bible that science is just discovering. By the way, the Josephus quote I sent you was from an Aramaic scroll and corresponds to the other translations in other languages of his writings- hundreds of them. Even Wiki admits his writings are valid. And I was responding to your statement that there was no outside validation of Jesus. I never said it was eye witness accounts- doesn't nee d to be if eye witness accounts are recorded and there is no evidence to the contrary in history. That is how main stream historians view ancient records- they give the benefit of the doubt to the document unless there is errors or contradictions written in the same time period. So it is most reasonable to accept the NT books as valid. But just reply on the questions if you are willing to look at this reasonably and open. My sense is that you have not really met the God I know and have personal experience with. So from one point of view, I do not believe in the God you portray either. I know a different one and he has given me reason to believe. My post-atheist life is so different but you are not interested in personal encounters so far.
Are you asking an objective question? I can address that when you answer my questions you suppressed. You see you seem to suppress those things that do point to God and only hang on to those that you deem as opposing Him. So when you want to look at this objectively, I am open to discuss. And until you answer my previous questions, no need to move to science where there is evidence that the existence of God is possible. No I can't absolutely prove Him just as you cannot absolutely disprove Him. That is where reason comes into play.
Your posts, with increasing frequency, employ personal attacks, which violates the forum guidelines. While it is true that certain members are... 'out there', your statements pass mere observation and cross into pejoratives. As a moderator, my options are limited the the following:
Appeal to you directly to stay within the forum guidelines.
Redact posts with offending comments.
The last one isn't likely, and I would prefer to avoid the second, so I'm trying for the first. Please refrain from using pejoratives that indicate other users are mentally unstable or otherwise deficient.
If you have any questions, comments or concerns, feel free to let me know. If you don't want this message on your page, please feel free to delete it after it has been read.
Welcome friend. It is amazing. Everyone FAILS to see we are born lacking belief, product of coitus & mutations following the creature plan of a DNA toolkit....iow we are related to every living thin on the planet, proven by DNA...and the BRAIN is the creator of the bizarre metnagical beliefs at the ROOT of ALL religions and also Schizophreni making GOD FAITH by educated people a mental disorder...
Amazing...and like schizophrenics the deluded God Believer DO NOT see it...always in denial at their disorder. Shame on blind intellectual atheist like Dawkins et all that do NOT see it...they keep treating the symptoms ignoring the ROOT of the disorder....Blisn fools.
Before Do and the 38 students layed down their lives - what most call "killed themselves" but for any who consider that Jesus was someone special, he was not hardly at all that caring about the physical body, so wouldnt' consider that they killed themselves because He knew they had a "soul body" that would still exist and be in the keeping of the Evolutionary Level Above Human (Ti and Do's terms for what has become known in religious circles as the Kingdom of God from/in the literal Heaven's., aka Outer space.), Do said, through one of his students that did a great deal of writing on his behalf that those that believed after they left could appeal to become Their followers/students but they had to accept all they taught and did and share that same information with others and accept the ramifications for doing so, that is very apparant is generally hostile or condescending and beyond belief for most. And by performing the task of disseminating the information they brought, when we died (not by our own hand as that was for those that had already disconnected from their humans roots and prepared and convinced Do that they were acting on what they wanted to do, which is a long story to actually prove but which I have written about on my blog and youtube channel.
Thus when these few who believe at this time die, their physical vehicle that is, the soul implant that was given them (as all humans are not seeded with a container that holds only Next Level mindstuff) will be in Do's words, "put on ice" what Christians call being "saved". Saved from what? Saved from the fate of all those who don't gravitate in that direction, their end which to most was not at all unexpected anyway so there really is no threat to it. Now it is threatening to those who have received soul implants before, even in a previous civilzation and know the recycling is underway. These are behind the motivating of humans to do their bidding as they too want to escape their fate which last time for many meant finding a cavern to drive their limited space craft into or to team up with the humans who had the technology to build underground bases or to find a location off the Earth that could provide some sustainence. The space aliens are all human or human equivilents. They need to eat and drink and breath some type/mixture of oxygen and they reproduce in a mammalian way though I'm not saying they can't be reptilian and would then reproduce the way reptiles do. But members of the Level Above Human (who are above only because they have been taken through the program that weaned them from their humanness by their efforts to follow the guidelines for doing so, as provided by the Next Level though a "son of man" - an Older Member from that Next Level who as service to their Older Member chooses to engage humans they prepared to become "fruit" for their gardening efforts, the entire purpose for the planet's existtence to begin with.
The Luciferans twisted the truth to make it into a country club belief system. Live a good life, sticking to a few moral rules and believe in Jesus and walla, you'll wake up in a rose garden. It's not at all that simple because the Next Level doesnt' need any new members so they are very, very selective and thereby we need to prove to them we want to be on their crew. They really don't have to prove anything to us. They don't need me either. It's for my growth that I have the task to deliever this info to others, to prove to Them I am trustworthy and will try to do the task they way they would which is a learning/apprentising process.
Well, I've just about said most of the bottom lines so I will move on, though am around for questions. An email anyone can use is firstname.lastname@example.org . And if you ever get in a jam that you are fearful about, you can try to call the names Ti and Do for help and perhaps you will witness a miricle. I know there is no other names that at this time can provide much help.
I guess I stuck my foot in my mouth right from the getgo in this forum by not stating my intention more directly. I tried but I know I didn't just lay it out as I would if someone was genuinly interested, though even then I shoot from the hip.
My excuse is that I didn't know what a bible reading atheist was. Perhaps some in this group read the biblefor a laugh or to find things to use to mock others, or to get ammo to show christians their limited thinking to get them back for all the persecution many so called Christians did to pagans and atheists and anyone who challenged them - Luther, etc. Because if that's the case, no wonder nothing I say means anything to you.
I don't really have to talk "bible" at all. Jesus didn't write the bible, but I don't even know if you think the Jesus story was all made up as some atheists like to throw out there - the Zeitgeist people in particular. I have had "supernatural" experiences but how can I prove what I think they were to anyone who has not had something at least similar or doesn't consider that there does exist a dimension of existence and even life that we simply can't detect in a way that we can easily repeat so to call it a scientific discovery. Actually there has been considerable science around the unseen world and lots of evidence of seemingly miraculous events. To me nothing is "magic" except things David Blaine does and Houdini and such, though even the things they have done, some of them can be attributed to "spirts" - discarnate humans which I have seen on many occasions and while in a "straight" frame of mind.
I have a friend who is a staunch atheist and also a physics teacher and is also very progressive and liberal in ways and in other ways very conservative, not unlike many people I know. I've got him to admit that there will be new discoveries, yet when I suggest an area in which something new might come along, and I even bring so called "evidence" like in the form of a doctor who wrote a book or something, he calls that doctor a quack doctor. When I suggest that I beleive there is a great deal of evidence of Space Aliens among us, not necessarily walking around, except in how they can influence humans to do their bidding, he thinks that's quackery and that I have no proof. I have seen flying objects that other physics teachers thought could have been somethuing out of this world, but for this fellow, it's impossible and what tops the cake is that he says he doesn't have the time to look into what I say is evidence. It's the same way, with all this talk I do about Ti and Do and the REAL Jesus as evidenced by what he was quoted to have said in the historic records we have. When I got banned from an atheist meetup it was because they wanted to have their club and didnt' like someone like me appearing to bust in and perhaps that's how you feel about me now. But I don't know if there are any in this group who do have an open mind really as it's increasingly rare I find.
Sure there are plenty that think they have it and think they are free thinkers until they meet the likes of, well, "me" because I happen to be one who had the most contact with Ti and Do for the longest period that didn't lay down my life with them and I'm talking about it far and wide. (and by the way I've been banned from many Christian blogs as well and from certain new age talk radio and other related sites). In my opinion you are very quick to draw conclusions about me that are not at all correct. As I have said, I have zero interest in followers, even if there were some, and there are actually a few who have suggested to me that I'm their teacher, but I have told them I am not in that way as if they believe this information then Ti and Do are their most immedieate teachers, the last ones incarnate, thus not yet distorted into myth as Jesus has morphfed into, which is a predictible circumstance to happen. And they can simply talk to them by thinking of them by their names and asking them what they want to ask for. Names in the unseen grids (like the matrix story) serve as an address, just like computers have memory and hard disk addresses and They have an assigned crew to receive requests and pass they up the chain of mind of their Family unit, to decide how to handle. Some requests the crew have instructions to handle.
You are correct. I am long winded. If you are ever in my shoes, you may do a better job but at least I'm not drawing all the absolutely wrong conclusions as you appear to do by your statements. You probably think I'm lying to trick people into becoming my students when I absolutely could care less about such. YOu would actually learn that as a fact if you weren't so defensive. YOu want facts - evidence - clear statements and I guess published writings by successful scholors. (and by the way I know I'm a lousy speller and don't care), but like I said in the first comment, in so many words, why bother.
However, I don't blame you for wanting more of what you consider substansive proof, so I ask you, can you think of 2-3 things you'd consider proof of Ti and Do being the Two Witnesses in rev 11, the return of the FAther and Son, the Woman in rev 12 being the FAther/Ti and the white horse in rev 6 being the male, Do, riding the vehicle named AppleWhite, and their taking names that represent notes in a song as in rev. 14, and requireing of their students the same exact things Jesus required and demonstrated no human characteristics of seeking ofpower or money or fame or ego or intellectual recognition - Serving Mammon, and told us as did Jesus, that we'd have to "give our lives" right from day 1 and how they "spoke plainly of the Father" as prophesized, not using parables/stories to illustrate their points and how they both returned to "make our abode (live with) you" thus were both "sons of humans/woman" which is an undercover operation, which the jews missed 2000 yrs ago and christians are largely missing now as they always are led to expect some supernatural phenomena of some being floating in the clouds on their white horse blowing a trumphet so all can rise up to meet him in the air, as Paul said, but by the way I have tons of scriptural proof that Pauls' vision was as Luciferian styled space alien who was allowed by the Level Above Human to present a challenge to students at the departure of the one called Jesus, and Ti and Do fulfilled the rev 11 prophecy by delivering their new information having new names, (first guinea and pig, and then Bo and Peep and then after the first global public notorority Ti and Do), though not exactly the way it was written because what was written was without understanding just how literal even prophecy can be. The greek word they translated to kill is apokteino which means "kill or hault in ANY way" while translators went on to add words to fill out the meaning around a largely misunderstood beginning to their translation. However, it could also have taken the exact path of their translation (like in the king james for instance) that is if the Next Level (what Ti called the Kingdom of God) - because it's the way of the Next Level to not predetermine all their steps as they change according to the response, tough don't change their requirements to make application to become a member of their crew. Now I can go through 100 more illustrations using bible and even certain core hindu (vedas) and buddhist texts that can be shown to be teachign the same lessons as we saw taught by the historic jesus as the jesus of the religious christian sects don't resemble the real Jesus. He was NOT a human family guy, and was not into prosperity and abundance materialistically and was NOT intellectual and there is lots of evidece he did exist but simply not in the form he's thought to have existed now, so in that sense Jesus doesn't exist. Like I said I have lots more of this kind of evidence and if you want to my site on http://www.youtube.com/user/3spm and/or http://www.sawyerhg.wordpress.com you will see lots of pieces of "evidence" that in any real court of law would be considered and a jury would have a hard time not agreeing point to ti and do as the total fulfillment of ALL prophecy.
Oh, there is lots more but here's an important distinction: Ti and Do would not allow children or minors to join them. They said that this kind of decision to join and this was before they knew that they would exit their task by their own hand, because it was from the beginning exactly as 2000 years ago in that it was a detachment from our human roots and behaviors to evolutionarily make application to an Evolutionary Level Above Human, where there are physical beings who have physical bodies that they can grow on a vine the way humans grow tomatoes, but that live on a type of photosynthesis whereby their "mind" is grown to actually have more power by a type of metamorphosis in the human vehicle becoming the chrysalis, to build the strength of the mind to a degree that could provide the power supply to one of these non-mammalian vehicles. They are not space aliens as some think though. There is lots more on this and they were talking like this in the early 1970's before star trek though they didn't know all they knew all at once. They gradually pulled the new information into their human brains so to only be a step ahead of their student body because otherwise the human brain can have some adverse responses when reality comes into question. In the past this metamorphic process was called "conquering our carnal nature" as we see repeated in many cultures because this is always what they, the gardeners require to graduate into their environment and Family. But children can't make such a decision. Now there is a ton more to say on all this but perhaps you have no interest so until you care to converse on this or something else, I will consider that I attempted to offer my experience to some of you here on think atheist. But on a closing note. The Level Above Human doesn't need new members. They don't need nor want anything from humans. They can grow humans on many planets in the Universe. Nor do they want robots. However they do have something to offer and they know it's very, very special but that few will seek it out, though they would be glad if it was many. It looks to us that those who laid down their lives were naive and/or nuts or needy but looks are deceiving. But because They don't need us, it's up to us to prove to them we can be trusted, so we have to be willing to give our total self to them eventually. That's not the standard now. As after the one called Jesus, belief alone in Ti and Do gets your soul pocket/container "put on ice" (not literally) to be brought back for the next opportunity. Thus there is no one on earth to believe in, no one to cow tow to, no one to impress, no one to trust, no books to by as all the info Ti and Do left behind is free, no organization to subscribe to, no need to visit my sites or to tell me you believe or don't and until we each die we can choose to petition Ti and Do in secret (in our closet so to speak) to ask their help and to know their will for us, who want to become their students. So if you really want PROOF, give it a shot. Ask Ti and Do to show you some proof they are real and are who They said they were - the promised return of FAther and Son, the woman being the one called the Father and the Son being the same Soul who played the the role of Jesus. And they never ranted and raved or raised their voice or treated any of us poorly. There is a reason they made world headlines for months on two occasions. They were clearly above and beyond human in every way, but you can't know that unless you take a good look to see.
From my limited view thus far, you are very quick to think you've seen all and call a spade a spade. I understand that. The FACT is I did not make an end of the world statement. I said that there would be a recycling and is that not a scientifically proven series of events that has occurred on earth at least one or more times past, according to leading archologists and geologists who have documented seas and plates having been evident where they are not now? Your responses to me are very little different that what I get from Christians. You appear to assume a great deal about yourself and what you know or believe in and that there is no way your going to be tricked to change. LIke I said, that's fine but if you want to fight, I'm game but let's lose the retorick and unfounded accusations as I have brought up. Be specific please. Comment to what I say and ask questions if it's not clear what I am saying please. I know I often say too much or get off topic.
And regarding Do and students laying down their lives, your saying many have done that, unless I am misreading you, I suppose you are referring to anyone who commits suicide and/or the Jim Jones and Solar Temple ppeople, but to compare these and think they are the same because there was some degree of otherworldliness consideration to their retorick and they died and seemingly by their own hands shows you know little to nothing about these situations. Do you know that there is evidence that many or most were actually forced by gunpoint to drink the poisoned kool aid in the jim jones case and there were children in both their camps and the solar temple people in Quebec and France and some were forced there as well. It wasn't presumed forcing. There were ones who survived both who testified how they were cohersed and forced and there are tapes of jim jones yelling at his followers to do it while his body guards with rifles were standing there with guns aimed on the people and some hunted down those who tried to escape into the woods. And in the Jim jones case there were zero indications he had anything to say that remotely coincided with what Jesus said, which can be said of most christians as well. Now with Do and the 38 + 3 students, it was very, very well documented by video tapes of those students that wanted to express themselves. Though there were many x-members and some who didn't believe none had anything to say against Ti and Do. No abuse, no cohersion at all. We were always free to leave.Do Do offerred us $1000 to leave at one point since it becamse a very, very comfortable life style. I have testimony to all of it. So if you are really a reasonable minded person wouldn't you want to ask some questions before you jump on the condemnation bandwagon?
I only brought up the observations of flying, etc. to demonstrate the evidence of what is possible we have been provided by no effort of our own. Instincts certainly can be flawed and so can various scientifically determinations. For instance how do scientists account for seeing objects in space in orbit about one another when the orbiting objects are much, much larger t han the object seemingly being orbited around? And how do scientists explain witnessing an object that appears tiny seeming to go into the sun and coming out the other side without being drawn into considering that the sun is holding the entire solar system in orbit from a vast difference and if such object is considered to be a comet as one report suggested, and these are from spaceweather.com a JPL/Nasa site, and they say a comet is made of rock and ice, how is it that it could survive the suns heat? Then there is recent evidence on two fronts that light isnt' the fastest something can move. And gravity is of late in question s to whether it's a force pushing down on us or a force field from within or both. My intuition is that it's both. I am an atheist when it comes to Religius depictions of what is Above HUman as it's at this time in particular full of holes, yet the holes I see I'm wager would not be ones others see.YOu seem to have made up your mind about a bunch of things and that's really fine with me. As I've said, I have no personal interest in proving anything to anyone but I guarantee if anyone does take the time to look at Ti and Do they will know one thing for sure. They were unlike anyone else and they were clearly operating outside the human norm so of course would be considered crazy. And as for their students. I was one for 19 years and yet though from the start I knew I'd be giving my life, even literally, I was seen by Ti, (the woman) as needing more lessons and so circumstances came about that I decided to leave, a long story I have posted on my youtube channel name: 3spm , in case anyone cares to examine that. I am quite used to being ridiculed yet it still does pain me some but if anyone had been in my shoes since I was 13 or so and first began to have experiences with the "unseen" world, rebelling from the catholic church, blah, blah, blah to receiving visits in dreams from Ti, then Do, then some fellow students who were all physically deceased where they have told me stuff and some fo it predictions that seem to have come true and the years of getting to know these two amazing people first hand and seeing how they knew stuff way before science yet were not scientitsts (though that's not what drew me to them), well all I can say is that it's mindblowing. Christians are among my greatest oppoents though I can easily shoot down virtually every one of their limited viewpoints. It's not that it's all wrong, waht they think, it's that there is a great deal MORE and I say that to atheists who I respect for discarding religion, while see so many also reject common sense with it. Adn those that are new age spiritualists are in many ways most primed to be seekers of what more t here is, yet most fear looking and especially when they have found a comfort zone. I know for a fact that humans have onkly barely scratched the surface of all that will be revealed in the next months, however many there are before the planet's surface is recyled to allow for a new planting. It really is just that objective, yet I don't say this with the fearfullness many expect. I have no death wish. I have a teenage daugher and friends and family that have degrees of perspective while most don't seem to have much of a clue but even if they do, dont''t express it to me as I am considered crazy for the most part yet at the same time it's clear to them I'm not. But please don't respond further unless you want to see my responses. Unlike most, I KNOW there is a ton to learn and should someone, anyone tell me something that peaks my interest, I'm going to look it over and as long as it peaks my interst I will look it over. But so far, though I stay pretty aware of all the fringe groups nothing even comes close to all the things Ti and Do gave us to think about and I can prove by years and years of first hand examples of Them as leaders, knowing most all of the 38 +3 that laid down theri lives that they knew exactly what they were doing and had to convince Do over years of consideration that they knew the ramifications. I can prove this and have offered lots of it on my youtube channel and blog at: sawyerhg.wordpress.com and it's not hokus pokus proof, like supernatural stuff. For one tiny instance: In 1976 having just formed spontaneously into a group called by the US national press that all cover the story for months, the UFO Two, who had attracted some 96 serious followers over a year on the road, then sent 19 of these out of the group because they felt they weren't ready. I've got tons of examples.
What is your criteria for "evidence"? Before there was "science" as the doctine of a sub-culture, humans knew most of the laws of physics pertaining to what was unseen as in gravity, what goes up comes down, the power in wind, airflight in the birds, requirements for healthy life on all evolutionary strata fuel in sunlight, water, elements, that unseen stuff, air & environmental security all of which were somehow just here and in precise proportions. Genetically those same humans who in their ancestry thought about such things came to not be surprised when tangible evidence (from experimentation (the results of with thought to be absolutes)) showed up the naysayers who always stuck to their guns (the absolutes of times past) against what others somehow had this sense of knowing. At this time, we see scientists world wide puzzelled though most will deny while religionists, spiritualists, paranormalists, pagans and the list goes on, well the same story really. Most everyone is quick to say what's not real or not true if they even pay mind to anything that's going on around them.
Who among us does not need medication of some sort, be it some substance or love or sense of being special and needed.
Your are right. If spamming is contacting a group with an agenda, I am guilty though my agenda is normal. It's not monetary, not narsacistic though I am aware I can at times be overly pleased with myself, what I count as a weekness because of how it promotes delusion. I am fishing but I've succeeded by throwing out the bait. I was caught myself at one time but was thrown back as too young, but I was looking to be caught, though I was very particular of which bait I was willing to comit to consuming as I would expect you must be or you've already made up your mind to not touch much if at all.
I'm not normally so cryptic and I know I'm not witty but the evidence is from two people who went crazy together, a Female and a Male, who have since passed, yet remain, who stand out among everyone else, hated with a passion or avoided like the plague, lied about, cried about, laughed about, con-spiri-tized and for a tiny few, considered and a tiny few more believed and their message was out of this world and clearly beyond the human evolutional kingdom.
The names they last used and are active labels to use now should anyone get an inkling to experiment are Ti and Do, yes like the song notes!
yep. I'm amused by how these guys can ramble on about nothing and somehow consider it as an argument for god. I guess the more intelligent apologists figure they have better shit to do than troll atheist forums. I hope our atheist counterparts don't do the same thing.