Ex-Athiest writing a book on how to save you godless heathens

hi there friends. i am an ex athiest and im a putting togethter a book/blog for christians about understanding and then saving athiests. I PROMISE, I AM NOT TRYING TO SAVE YOU! but i would greatly appreciate your input.

like i said i used to be an athiest. actually i was more of an anti-christian. i was very thorough wile compiling my arsenal of anti-christian material, and was very articulate when fighting christians. i had a long list of great arguments against christianity, but i could use more.

lets face it. alot of christians are annoying, i agree, but the big idea here is that most christians have absolutely no concept of life without god. so they dont understand athiesim at all. one of the purposes of my book is to illustrate that athiests are not all terrible satanists. that alot of them are actually really good hearted people.

if you are willing to help me out i would appreciate it. if not, feel free to tell me to go to hell lol... please respond to the following 2 statements/questions

what is your best argument against jesus. not god, but jesus specifically????

what is the most annoying thing about christians? or what do you dislike about christians???? 


Views: 1457

Tags: christian, ex-athiest., good, jesus

Comment by CJoe on January 18, 2013 at 6:40pm

C'mon guys. I realize you've all dealt with theists before, but a little intellectual honesty would do us good here.

We can't use the "no true Scotsman" fallacy. In order to be atheist, *all* you have to do is NOT believe there's a god... even if the reasons you don't believe there's a god are not scientific or based in research. Also, maybe he wasn't familiar with all the arguments we make on Think Atheist, or elsewhere on the internet. He could've been a passive atheist. You don't have to be an atheist activist to be atheist. You don't have to have thought about why you don't believe. You don't have to have thought about religion, or theology, or anything... It is possible for him to have been atheist and then converted to Christianity. I've seen it happen before, even though I was totally perplexed by it. The kid was in search of some "emotional healing" that atheism, in and of itself, cannot provide. There are things that *could* have provided him comfort/affirmation, but the quick-fix was Christianity. Say a prayer, have wrongs forgiven... blam! All better (for a while).

And the criticism of his spelling/punctuation is a red herring. Someone already pointed it out; you don't have to be a Writing Major to write books anymore. You can get published on Amazon. We've had lots of atheists on Think Atheist who want to write about their experience even though they're not prolific writers, too. So, engage Cameron if you want to... but I feel going after his spelling is a cheap shot.

But, Cameron... your approach *did* put people on the defensive. You insisted you weren't here to "save" us, but you admitted you *were* here to do research on a book meant to do just that, or help Christians do that. Whether you mean it to be or not, it *is* insulting and presumptuous. If you were atheist at one point, then you should know what coming in here like that would feel like to us. Your seeming forgetfulness about your own feelings as an atheist make people doubt your sincerity.

Also, you asked what our arguments against Jesus' existence were. We gave you those arguments, but instead of saying "Oh I see, I'll include that in my book, " you claimed that many of us knew "absolutely nothing" about the Bible, etc. If you're researching for a book about the atheist experience/opinion, dismissing our experience or opinions implies you're being disingenuous; it implies you're here for something *other* than listening and discovering our thoughts. Just a hint: that's not how you do objective research.

You accused us of being ignorant, yet refuse to engage in a debate. You don't see how that comes across? And I know *I* never insulted you.

Comment by Diane on January 18, 2013 at 7:00pm

We are all at varying levels of education, age, experience, finesse, recovery, aggression, etc.  Many of us here have read the Bible, many have studied it, and some are bona fide Biblical scholars.  Some of us have been seriously harmed by Christians and/or Christian institutions, practices, and/or tenets. We have individual histories that most would likely happily share with a reasonably sincere-seeming inquirer.  

I want Christians to understand us, but not to save us.  I want them to understand us and then let us be.  I cannot stress this enough.  You would be doing everybody a favor if you wrote a book that allows Christians insight into how to respect us, coexist with us, and, most achingly important, stop trying to save us.

Comment by Kairan Nierde on January 18, 2013 at 8:28pm

Ok, Cameron W, I am in not convinced that you are being entirely honest but I can see how this exchange can benefit us both, despite what appears to me to be an unecessary lack of transparency.  We talk with curious life-long Christians as well as those who say they are recent converts. Whoever you are, I'll give you my view on these questions.

what is your best argument against jesus. not god, but jesus specifically????

I think this is odd to ask. When I was Catholic, we were told to believe that Jesus and God (and the Holy Ghost) are different manifestations of the same being.  I never really accepted that.  I always saw Jesus as a moral teacher and sacrificial lamb.  I almost always prayed to God, maybe to Jesus around 8% of the time.  Never to the Holy Spirit or Mary. If I have any beef with Jesus, it's probably that his teachings aren't that effective in getting his followers to behave well.  I would expect a higher rate of people behaving well after encountering Christianity, especially if one is to believe that Christianity is inspired by the actions and teaching of the son of a God/a demi-god.  I don't think Jesus set the bar too high for humans to follow his teachings accurately. 


what is the most annoying thing about christians? or what do you dislike about christians???? 

I dislike the same thing I disliked about Christians when I was a Christianity: immoral behavior by those who claim to be morally superior.  Hypocracy pisses me off.  A lot of Christians give lipservice to the Gospel and value material wealth, power, prestige, vanity, etc. above the teachings of Jesus.  The Christians who do follow Jesus' teachings more carefully tend to be fundmentalists, in my experience, who also subscribe to Old Testament values.  OT values are not always in line with the Gospel teachings and less often in line with enlightened, "modern" morality.  So, in these two groups you have people who live according to some of the worst concepts humanity has produced, from the ancient world and in contemporary times.  It's proably possible to say the same things about members of many different faith traditions, but you were just asking about Christians.

Comment by Val Wuthrich on January 18, 2013 at 9:11pm
In your book just keep repeating if you dob't believe you are going to burn in hell for ever and ever and ever. Put the fear of God in us non-believers at every opportunity.
Comment by Doug Reardon on January 19, 2013 at 12:13am

"go to hell!"

Comment by Louis on January 19, 2013 at 1:26am

I have read many of the comments here and agree with most of the responses. I think Diane recently nailed it perfectly as far what I think about this. I too feel that Christians need to respect us for who we are and simply let us be. Many of them need to understand that we do not need/want to be saved or converted in any way. There needs to be a simple understanding that we're all human with many differences and have a right to be respected regardless of what religion (or lack of), sexual orientation, race, etc. 

Comment by Unseen on January 19, 2013 at 9:16am

"like many of you, i spent my whole life surrounding myself with like minded people who supported my position..."

I love that statement. He's actually been a Christian his whole life, not an atheist, because if he had been an atheist he'd know that most of us are not now, nor have we ever been, surrounded by like-minded people.

Comment by Diane on January 19, 2013 at 10:23am

You, sir, are right!  Besides my family of origin, I had missed being around like-minded people most of my life.  When I realized there were other people like me, I was relieved, surprised, and elated.

Comment by SteveInCO on January 19, 2013 at 10:45am

Diane touched on it, but if I had to summarize my wants as regards to the fact that I happen to be an atheist:

I want Christians to realize we do not believe there is a god.  We are not "mad" at him or doing this just to rebel or what have you (the people in it just to rebel tend to go pagan/wiccan).  Stop telling us we need to be saved as if we haven't heard that line a godzillion times before.  We don't believe there is a hell to be saved from, since we don't believe in the god who (didn't) make it.

And by the way if that punishment awaits us, surely that is enough and you can stop making our lives hell on earth?  Instead an atheist with the guts to admit it is ostracized and in some parts of the country has no choice but to leave town.  And fired from jobs. And harassed.

And another:  Stop trying to use the government to push your agenda.  It is NOT (and I regret the lack of a fourth way to emphasize that word) an infringement on your religious liberty to require that the government--that means courthouses, that means public schools, and that means libraries, to remain SILENT on the issue of whether there is a god, and if so what is he/she/it like and does that god want to be prayed to. 

The sooner that you all can get it through your thick skulls that we do not want to stop your privately conducted religious observances but don't want you using the government to inflict them on everyone, the happier we will all be.

Comment by Meg Fields on January 19, 2013 at 1:22pm

"Feel free to tell me go to hell"

Well, 'Cameron W.', go to hell.


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