As you guys know easter was last sunday. And after consistently seeing status updates on facebook about the magic that is jesus rising from the dead, I felt I wanted my own opinion on the matter to be heard. I know that facebook isn't really the proper forum to hold a debate but nevertheless I posted the picture that I attached to this post. Being my first post ever on this site, here is a link to the picture too just in case I didn't attach it correctly. http://www.motifake.com/13920
The next part of the post are the ensuing comments made about the picture. The key players are myself and my friend Tracy who is also an atheist. Henry who I'm sure you will know his position on the matter after reading the comments. I just wanted to share this with people of my same mindset and hear what you have to say about it. I'm not looking for validation if I was right or wrong for posting that. I'm just curious what others have to say on the matter. Its quite long so I apologize for the length. Things got a bit heated in the exchanging back and forth.
Moe T: Very inappropriate. How dare you tarnish the ghostbusters logo. Peter venkman would be pissed.
Henry D: That's not funny.
Ashley: Not at all
Tracy M: This is hilarious and awesome. Happy Zombie Jebus day, Nick!
Nick Q: Happy Zombie jebus day! Remember to replenish your stockpile. Shotguns, shovels, flamethrowers, and the other usual items.
Mike D: Go you.
Henry D: Hey Nick, when are you going to take shots at Jews or Muslims or is that not what Lady Gaga thinks is cool?
Tracy M: Well given that today isn't a Jewish or Muslim holiday, that wouldn't make much sense, would it?
Henry D: This photo could clearly be posted any day of the year. It's an insult to all Christians. Why are Christians always attacked in this country? It's perceived as cool because there's a hit TV show bashing it or something. I'm dying to see you, Tracy, or Nick rip into Jews or Muslims.
Nick Q: Yeah, firstly I don't listen to her so let's get that out of the way. And I'm not going to take shots at religions I don't know enough about. I was raised a catholic/christian so I know how ridiculous it is. And on a side note, today is Easter so there you go.
Henry D: So why are you celebrating Easter and enjoying time with your family? "Atheists" love getting their days off on Christian holidays but then post BS ripping into it.
Nick Q: Use "celebrating easter" loosely. A day off is a day off. I could care less why I have a day off.
Henry D: It's stupid. You can't enjoy the benefits of celebrating a holiday then post disrespectful crap bashing it. It's immature, childish, and offensive to your friends and family.
Nick Q: Hmmm. Bashing somebody that has different views than yours. How very christian of you
Henry D: I'm calling you disrespectful because you are. You hate religions and think they're a bunch of short stories created for fun and people who believe them are stupid. SNORE
Tracy M: Henry, you're a Christian, yes? Then turn the other cheek like Jesus would do. Also, swearing is against your religion - I am pretty sure if you ask yourself "What would Jesus do?" the answer would not be "swear on the internet". Why are you on Facebook yelling at people for expressing their views instead of in Church worshiping your Savior? I'm pretty sure Jesus would disapprove of your actions today.
PS - Easter is a pagan holiday which the Christians usurped. So we actually have a day off today because of Pagan fertility celebrations, not because of Jesus. Also it's Sunday, which we always have off.
Christians are not "always attacked" in this country - you're the majority. You control most of the government. You are continually succeeding in getting laws passed which legislate your morality and your religion. So quit whining because other people are peacefully and humorously expressing their views. You're not being persecuted.
Henry D: I love how atheists are the experts in what the Bible teaches. How are Christians not attacked? You liberals love burning crosses on TV, calling nuns prostitutes on TV (Glee), loving Judas and sucking down crosses on MTV (Lady Gaga), I can ...go on FOREVER. Easter represents new life, Resurrection, hence Christ. What do Christians control in the government? Seriously, enlighten me. This is a persecution and an attack. Liberals love persecuting actually.
Tracy M: I will bet you $20 I know more about Christian theology and have read more of the Bible than you. Not that it's a pissing contest, but there you go.
I personally am not in charge of what Glee or Lady Gaga do. But just FYI, people saying bad... things about Christians is NOT persecution. Nobody is murdering you. Nobody is preventing you from worshiping. Nobody is burning your house down. You have NO IDEA what persecution really is. HINT: it is not other people peacefully exercising their first amendment rights, no matter how much you dislike what they are saying.
Almost every elected official is a Christian. Every law restricting abortion is because of Christian "morality." Laws against gay marriage - also because of Christianity.
Tracy M: Also, Christ doesn't have a monopoly on representing new life. That concept was around WAY before him. In fact, there are NO original ideas in Chrstianity. It's all recycled from other religions.
Tracy M: OMG seriously. I can't believe you actually think you're being persecuted because somebody else DARES to criticize your religion. LOL
Henry D: I'm not going to hold my breathe what you think or "know" about Christianity. How is demonizing a religion not persecution? It doesn't matter what you define it is because it is. Ripping into a religion, demonizing it's base, and reporting ...on a daily basis that priests are perverts is persecution and destruction. I'm a fan of the Constitution so don't lecture me on that. What laws restrict abortions? The state PROMOTES getting abortions like it's a drive through at McDonald's. Gay marriage is banned because liberals don't even bring the conversation to the table. If every Obama zombie voted supported gay marriage it would pass. LIGHTBULB! Most Americans don't. It's Americans who put representatives into political office. THEY don't support gay marriage, not the politician. That's a little tid bit you need to take away with you. Democrats hate gay marriage. They don't even attempt to pass bills for it. Anyway, I can go on forever but my computer is about to die and I'm going to celebrate this beautiful Christian holiday with my family. Which apparently, you're doing the same...but then bashing Christianity...but then giving me a Bible lesson...and...yeah...
Tracy M: "OH NO someone said a thing I don't like! WAAAH persecution! I'm being oppressed! This is JUST AS BAD AS being murdered for my beliefs!"
Henry D: Glad you can participate in an adult conversation. Happy Easter!
Tracy M: 1. Lots of priests molest little boys and the Church protects them. Maybe you should stop that and people would stop talking about it?
2. Definition of persecution: "a program or campaign to exterminate, drive away, or subjugate a people because of their religion, race, or beliefs" - other people criticizing you hardly arises to that.
You are obviously completely, totally, 100% ignorant of abortion and gay marriage laws, so you should at least read wikipedia before you run your mouth about those.
I'm actually not celebrating at all. Enjoy your self righteous ignorance!
Henry D: 1. Priests only molest boys? WHAT? Clearly you love your corporate media. I'm assuming you also believe there's never been abuse by a religious leader in Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, or another organized religion? It's only the priests who love touching little boys. 2. You just defined what I already know. A program, or campaign to exterminate a belief...that's what the media is, telling people they can't say 'Merry Christmas' in public, taking away "God" in the Pledge of Allegiance, those are CAMPAIGNS to destroy a belief. And you just liberally imploded about abortion and gay marriage because you couldn't argue anything I just said because I'm right.
Tracy M: Can you even read? I never said priests only molest boys. I said lots of priests molest boys. I never said nobody else molests them. LEARN TO READ PLS. nobody is trying to destroy your belief. People are just allowed to have a different opinion and shouldn't be forced to worship your god. We have separation of church and state, which is why god shouldn't be mentioned in the pledge. There's a huge difference between everyone being free to have their own belief, and you forcing others to obey your religion.
A campaign to destroy a belief would be something like i've said before - actually killing you, burning down your churches, making your religion illegal. NOBODY is doing any of these things to you.
I could give you a rundown of gay marriage and abortion laws, but honestly it's not my job to educate you and it would probably be a huge waste of time. Go read about it yourself and you will see almost every single state has major restrictions on abortion, effectively preventing women from getting them, and no state actively promotes abortion. As for gay marriage, some civilized progress is being made there in a lot of places, but in most states its still illegal, primarily because of Christianity.
Tracy M: BTW at least Jews don't occasionally go on giant killing sprees known as "the Crusades" or "the Inquisition."
Nick Q: You're right because you believe in a delusion that people have believed in for thousands of years. A lie is still a lie if everyone believes it. If you need to believe in something higher and more important than you because it helps you sleep better at night, that's your problem.
Henry D: Do you support Israel's ethnic cleansing of Palestine?
Tracy M: That's more of a war than a killing spree. I don't support any religiously motivated war.
Tracy M: Although good point. All murderous organized religions are bad. Just because the Jews and Muslims aren't perfect doesn't mean your religion doesn't suck.
Henry D: Wrong answer. Christians are being exterminated (killed because of their faith) in Africa as we speak. China just arrested dozens for celebrating Easter. Is that cool?
Tracy M: Yeah, now that's persecution. Lady Gaga wearing a vinyl nun costume is NOT. Also, if my answer was wrong, then you must mean that NOT supporting Israel's war is wrong. So then you support Israel's "killing spree"? You should be more precise to avoid confusion.
Henry D: Wrong again. Killing people isn't just persecution. I don't support Israel because of the cleansing. It's not a "war" when you fight back when your people are being destroyed. Is it only cleansing when you sit and let it happen? Snore.
Tracy M: That entire paragraph makes no sense at all. Why are you still here? Don't you have an imaginary friend to worship?
Tracy M: Plus, just because people in other countries are being persecuted doesn't mean you are.
Henry D: It's my faith! Christians should just go on their merry way because they live on the other side of an ocean? By your twisted logic the Crusades are irrelevant because it was on another continent. Be careful with what you're saying.
Tracy M: So because people in a different country are being persecuted, that means you're being persecuted? Talk about twisted logic. Actually it's not even twisted logic. It's just stupidity.
Maybe you should go over there and do something about it instead of arguing with people on the internet.
Henry D: Stop bending reality. Since gay marriage doesn't directly affect you, why do you care? Stop being childish. Terrifying you study law.
Nick Q: It's called being decent to your fellow human being. That's why we care about gay rights.
Nick Q: Learn to do it and grow up
Tracy M: LMAO yes we are ONLY allowed to care about that which affects us. For example, it is well established that white people cannot possibly care about whether black people can vote.
Childishness is blindly believing everything you're told without questioning it.
Tracy M: I wish I could bend reality. Then I'd make sure separation of church and state is actually enforced! haha
Henry D: Tracy, I'm arguing with your own logic. Nick, who said I didn't support gay rights? Stop making things up.
Tracy M: If by "arguing" you mean "babbling incoherently" then sure. You haven't actually countered any of my arguments. If you're going to stick around, let's get back to the real issue here. You claim Christians are being attacked and persecuted in this country. Name ONE example of that. One real example of Christians actually being attacked (not just criticized or satirized) or being persecuted. Lady Gaga and MTV do not count; as that doesn't actually DO anything to you other than annoy you slightly. It doesn't oppress you or stop you from practicing your beliefs in any way.
Tracy M: The fact is, you enjoy total religious freedom here. You are in the majority. You are never persecuted or oppressed. Instead of enjoying that freedom and practicing peacefully and keeping your religion to yourself, you claim you are persecuted, make a big stink about it, and then at the same time try to force your beliefs on everyone else.
Tracy M: Frankly, I suspect your horror at being criticized is simply reactionary to the fact that deep down, you know it's all a bunch of bull, and if you actually were to engage in rational and critical thinking about it, you would quickly see it ...crumble. Because you desperately want to cling to this and use it as a crutch, you want to stamp out anything contrary to it, so you can continue to float along in your ignorant, blissful little stream of not having to take responsibility for your life. Put that in your Easter basket and smoke it.
Tracy M: How do I know this is true? You're obviously so upset by a stupid cartoon on the internet that you're willing to waste hours and hours fighting about it with STRANGERS who are mean to you instead of just going and enjoying your holiday and praising your imaginary friend.
Henry D: Takes two to tango. Duh.
Mike D: Nick Q, after browsing this thread you said "It's called being decent to your fellow human being.” And yet you mock and ridicule Christians on a special holiday? You're a hypocrite.
Tracy M: Henry - A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. See, I can come up with random irrelevant sayings too! OMG that means I WIN!
Tracy M: Mike - depriving someone of their civil rights and joking about someone's religion are not on the same level. What makes your religion so special and sacred that nobody is allowed to criticize it? It's just some made-up crap that has NO BASIS IN FACT. I joke about Santa Claus and Greek myths, too.
If you don't like what Nick is posting, DON'T LOOK AT IT. Simple, easy solution, which you control 100%. Gays being deprived of their civil rights? Not the same thing.
Nick Q: I'm mocking and ridiculing the religion. I could care less what anybody else believes in
Tracy M: Mike, when Nick Q starts campaigning to prevent you from marrying the person you love, to prevent you from adopting children, and to stop you from getting medical care which you have a Constitutional right to, ALL on the basis of his lack of belief, you let me know and I will give him a stern talking to! lmao
Nick Q: Tracy I hope you smack me way before I start doing any of those things.
Mike D: Both of you are hypocrites. Go live in France where wearing burkas are illegal. Or how about in Saudi Arabia where women can't vote? You both live in a reality where up is down and down is up. Christianity teaches to love another and bring peace to your neighbor. But your deluded, MSNBC filled minds tell you that Catholics and Christians are all pedophiles and deprive people of so-called "civil rights." Wake up.
Joe: As a bystander, you are all taking things to the extreme. Catholics have done some bad things in the name of God, like many of the other religions. Nick, I suggest you try to remove that cartoon, solely because you are a front man for your company, and it reflects poorly on the name (loosing customers never bodes well). Before you begin to retort this, I suggest you all go and read up on the vatican two. A right which tried to move the RC religion closer to the people. Also, just one last thing to mention, the Catholic church has over the past few years, begun to report suspicious findings with regard to the questionable activities of priests and children.
Joe: A final thought, with every group there are zealots
Nick Q: Mike I was raised in the catholic/christian faiths. And I'm glad that I did because they do teach you those things I believe that human beings should act and behave. Peace, love, and good towards your fellow man. But what I don't believe in is all the magical fairytale part of both religions. You don't have to have religion in order for you to be a decent human being. And when that same religion that teaches love and peace but at the same time teaches ignorance, that's when I have a problem with it.
Tracy M: LOL I never said once I wanted to stop you from practicing your religion, ban burkas, or stop women from voting. I just don't feel the need to kowtow to any of those absurd beliefs, or yours either. Everyone should be FREE to practice their religion, or not, as long as it doesn't hurt anyone.
I don't agree that Christianity simply teaches love and peace. It teaches division and hate, and judgment.
It's great that the Catholics have finally started ratting out rapists instead of protecting them. Bravo! Now if only they would stop promoting the spread of AIDS we'd have some real progress to talk about.
If a few customers are "loosed" because of a cartoon Nick posted on his friends-only FB page, then I hope very much that they enjoy their newfound freedom.
Moe T: Wow this convo got intense. To bad all points are deemed invalid based solely on the fact that it was via facebook. Sorry guys, Gods judgement is that you all fail. also, go see the real god, Thor, starring Oscar winner Natalie portman!
Nick Q: Hahaha Moe. Awesome ending
Mike D: The only ending is that both of you are ignorant and completely intolerant. God forbid people celebrate their beliefs, right?
Nick Q: Yup that's what the whole post is about. LOL
Tracy M: Oh, Mike. I pity you for your pathetic lack of reading comprehension and general lack of ability to perform basic logical reasoning tasks.
STOP PERSECUTING ME AND NICK Q BY SAYING THINGS WE DON'T LIKE! IT'S MEAN!
Tracy M: Nick Q, we have definitely been persecuted by the media - Fox news is TOTALLY persecuting us. And also those televangelists! Persecutors!
I have been saying all along in this thread that I want to stop people from celebrating their beliefs because them celebrating their beliefs where I can ignore it is PERSECUTION to my beliefs! And! AND! All those facebook status updates about Jesus? PERSECUTING ME! I'm so offended! They have to take them all down because my feelings might be hurt! Woe is me!
Veronica X: My phone won't load all the comments to this, maybe it's already been discussed, but how does this big, bad picture prevent you, or any one else, from believing/worshiping in the religion of your choice? How is it ok to say you believe something, and not ok to say you don't?
Nick Q: I don't know about you Tracy. But I was feeling very persecuted this whole time.
Tracy M: Well Nick, that's because you're confused. See, only CHRISTIANS are persecuted. Everyone else is just wrong, so it's OK to be mean to them and tell them that their beliefs don't matter. That's not persecution, that's spreading the word of god.
@Veronica: clearly this cartoon stops them from going to church, creates a law making Christianity illegal, and forces them to worship easter eggs.
Mike D: Don't get all caught up in a fit, kids.
Tracy M: But, you're persecuting me on Facebook! I can't just turn off the computer and walk away! I'm trapped here, being subjected to your persecution against my will! You're just ignorant and intolerant! Your mind is warped by the media! I like turtles! Why don't you just move away to Singapore, where spitting on the sidewalk is illegal? HUH? WHY DON'T YOU? It's because you hate America! Terrorist!