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Unseen's Discussions

What does "earn" mean to you?

Started this discussion. Last reply by Unseen 12 minutes ago. 33 Replies

"Liberals just want to take money that isn't theirs and give it to people who didn't earn it" is the sort of thing I've heard from conservatives many times.This often comes up when talking about…Continue

Tags: socialism, redistribution, earnings, wealth

Does Each person possess an inviolability founded on justice...

Started this discussion. Last reply by Simon Paynton Nov 23. 14 Replies

...that even the welfare of society as a whole cannot override? (John Rawls' most famous quote.)If not why not? If so, what would it mean in particular cases?Continue

Tags: individual, justice, Rawls

Anarchism: threat or menace? (Scott Graves, this means you)

Started this discussion. Last reply by Ian on Wednesday. 91 Replies

Okay, forgive me the attention-getting headline. Scott Graves has proclaimed himself an anarchist. I went through this phase for about a year when I was in my late teens. Since then, I think I've…Continue

Tags: anarchy, anarchism, anarchist

Paris attack will boost Trump

Started this discussion. Last reply by TJ Nov 17. 8 Replies

The GOP is hard line anyway and a lot of people will look at Donald Trump with his anti-immigration stance and his position that the nation needs firm borders or even a wall, then look at Paris, and…Continue

Tags: Republicans, poll, anti-immigration, immigration, Paris

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Latest Activity

Unseen replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"Absolutely true. HOWEVER, this is simply an expression of an attitude and has no truth value. And I think it's pretty clear who this attitude benefits. Let's suppose we see some value in it. Does it follow that we must accept it without…"
12 minutes ago
Gary Clouse replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
" Well, since you are asking for opinions, I'll jump in here. The most fundamental concept in capitalism s the idea that ownership of capital entitles the owner the revenues and liabilities generated by the capital. Money is earned by…"
3 hours ago
Unseen replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"And so, no particular relationship between compensation and how hard it is to find someone who CAN do the job.  What's harder to do, running a large corporation or teaching higher mathematics to ghetto teens, for example? How do you…"
3 hours ago
Davis Goodman replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"Unseen is completely correct here Many economists including Nicolas Taleb have done massive research on the topic (comparing what people call shrewed business decisions or shrewed business personalities) with all the measurable variables…"
8 hours ago
Unseen replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"I think I as well as most people think of "work" as something accomplished through the direct application of physical force or brainpower. This is somewhat akin to the definition of "work" physicists use.  Once you can…"
17 hours ago
Reg The Fronkey Farmer replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"I would use the term “Earn” as money paid for work done. A business generates income from the money paid for its goods or services. If you use your own factors of production (your land, your labor, your capital) to get the apple tree to…"
19 hours ago
Unseen replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"One way of it being hard to find someone yp do the job is for it to be hard to find someone who wants the job enough to keep it.  At any rate, even if it's hard to find someone who CAN do the job, it doesn't follow from that that they…"
19 hours ago
TJ replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"Then no busness earns money, it just accumulates the money spent by its customers when they buy its product? That's quite a convoluted argument. no one erans a salary, they just accumulate the money paid to them by the company they work for,…"
19 hours ago
Reg The Fronkey Farmer replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"Just a passing comment -  The capacity to earn money and the capacity to generate wealth are two different things. Bill Gates did not earn $70 billion. He generated wealth of $70 billion from how we all spent our collective earnings."
21 hours ago
TJ replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"And by your logic there are an equal number of high and low paying jobs...and not simply more lower paying jobs. :D"
22 hours ago
TJ replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"High turnover doesn't mean hard to find people to do it, just that you have to do it over and over again. IE: If its a low paying job, workers will take something that pays more when available. They are then replaced by those to whom the…"
22 hours ago
Unseen replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"So, according to your logic, there should be no low-paying jobs which are hard to fill. Why, then, if I go to Craiglist are there ads for so many low-paying jobs? In fact, most of the thousands of ads just here in the Portland, Oregon area are for…"
23 hours ago
TJ replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"Again, we do not earn based upon how hard the work is to DO, we get paid based upon how hard it is to find someone who CAN DO IT. If its hard to do but everyone CAN do it, its a low paying job. If its hard to find someone capable of running a…"
Unseen replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"Taking it back to the top level... When what you accumulate is the direct result of efforts you put in on a daily basis, I don't think anyone can deny that his/her income is earned. So the artist for sure earns and also deserves his…"
TJ replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"OK, so, skip to evaluating the piles...which would need to happen TO see what was there to be earned, or not. Bite off one example: John is born into a hardworking lower class family, his father skrimps and saves, and sends John to Harvard, and, as…"
Unseen replied to Unseen's discussion 'What does "earn" mean to you?'
"I am not particularly interesting in where it would lead. I'm more interested in concepts like "earning" and "deserving." I'm asking questions a moral and/or political philosopher would ask. Conservatives claim liberals…"

Profile Information

Your Religious Status
About Me:
MA in Philosophy. I call myself an atheistic agnostic. In other words, I'm atheist until someone proves I'm wrong.
Relationship Status
Why are you here?
I followed a link on twitter
The religion you left
Why you left your religion.
Strangely, you don't include the most obvious answer: God doesn't appear to exist, even as a possibility.
How did you hear about Think Atheist?
followed a link I saw on twitter

Unseen's Blog

Scientists are now admitting that nuclear power is greener than other alternatives

Posted on January 8, 2015 at 12:29pm 36 Comments

The full read from which the following quote is taken is here.

Nuclear power is one of the least damaging sources of energy for the environment, and the green movement must accept its expansion if the world is to…


A great number of paradoxes, starting with Scroedinger's cat

Posted on April 18, 2014 at 8:00pm 1 Comment

I'm sorry, but I had to stop listening to this bit at about the fourth paradox due to being out of breath from laughing. How long can you last?

Famous last words. No...really!

Posted on February 6, 2014 at 6:30pm 1 Comment

I found a website where Texas lists every capital execution from 1982 on. One of the more interesting things about it is that it includes any last statements the prisoners made. Interesting reading. Lots of "foxhole converts" among them, I note.

OBAMACARE Is Better Than You Think

Posted on September 24, 2013 at 11:40am 1 Comment

In just one week the main part of Obamacare will begin to kick in. This is the state level exchanges that will allow the uninsured to be covered. Beginning on October 1, people will be able to sign up to get insurance in their state regardless of their health.

Most people signing up on the exchanges will qualify for subsidies based on their income and family size. This means that the cost of insurance will be less than the advertised price.

This is good…


Comment Wall (20 comments)

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At 3:26pm on December 14, 2014, Virgil said…

You and I got off to a bad start and I almost gave up on AT cuz of it.  I'm glad I didn't.  Amazing how much you and I agree on besides views on how jobs are created, the meaning of wealth and what produces it. All of that I believe about those things are from my personal experience in the past 5 years since becoming a civilian. I believe in them more today than ever before but all that is teeny minor crap compared to my core convictions.  The main reason I argued with you about that was the wrong reason to to argue.  I was offended on a personal level by things you said and I gave into that & put my anger ahead of reason. 

Interrogation.  Please point out any errors in you see in my reasoning.... (why ask, you'll do it even if I don't ask hahahaha!)

my last tour 2009 in Afgh I was a E4, a corporal, just one tiny small guy the big picture. When I heard this report was coming out I thought "oh shit!  This is going to get nasty!"  But wait... "nasty" is a relative term. As a war vet, my idea of nasty in regards to what could have been in that report  is waaaaaaaaay different from Joe Civilian's definition of nasty.  In fact my definition of nasty info on EIT would be impossible for him to wrap his head around and not break out in a chicken little dance. 

There's no damned way Feinstein & the others with that report know less about EIT than I do unless the CIA and armed forces have been totally lying to them.  That's just not possible. 

I've read all I can find for details, watched TV for the hot talking points and I have come to the conclusion that whole report just about has to be a psyop to cover ALLLLLLLLL the shit guys like me know and all the shit guys like me don't know.  For me there hasn't been ONE DETAIL in that report that was newsy or nasty.  I really feel what's going on is a well planned magician's trick that starts  off with him saying, "watch me cut off my right hand" to distract everyone IN THE WORLD while they sneak a 60 ton plaid elephant across the stage. 

This isn't a conspiracy theory about some secret plot from the Obama white house.  This is a theory about possibly pulling off a great Intel move to benefit the very people and programs that it's supposed to be making the focus of world wide outrage. 

But wait.  There's more.

There were things in that report that were totally ridiculous and almost funny when you thin about them.  ONLY  dummasses would fall for some of the shit AND the media and none of the "experts" have even tried to point the silly shit out. 

Think. The report says next to no vital intel has been obtained through EIT.  It says most of the intel obtained is lies told under torture.  I don't recall ONE time in my whole 22 months in Afgh when we were told, "get your guns and let's go find some bad guys to shoot." Every time we did anything se went out to specific places looking at specific times, to look for specific people, specific things and act like we were just dumb gyrines who didn't know what we were looking for. One time we did a four hour search on a small 6 house village before "noticing" the exact item we'd been shown satellite images of sitting right in our way the whole time.   Sooooo where did that intel come from?  The pentagon must be using psychics and have consult fortune tellers.  ...........  That's just one example.  One time we were rushed out to set up a  fake road check, told what car to look for, who would be in it and make sure its 4 tires were blown out 1 km before the road block so the occupants would have to get out and walk after all traffic on the road was stopped to prevent them from hitching rides.  When we go the guys back to base there were interesting guys there. After a staged accidental explosion the 3

At 9:06pm on September 19, 2014, Davis Goodman said…

Can't believe we weren't official friends here all this time!!!!

At 3:34am on September 2, 2014, Demetrius Alcala said…

You stole CBS

At 7:51am on August 10, 2014, Brandon Bissell said…

Yeah thanks. I was hoping to talk to you about something so I'll send a message soon.

At 10:30pm on March 25, 2014, Justin said…

ah yes Im new to it, thank u

At 2:58am on March 25, 2014, EMil Wentzel said…

Thanks :)

I'm still feeling my way around, glad to see so many wonderful positive and active voices here :)

At 11:56am on February 7, 2014, Reg The Fronkey Farmer said…

Thanks for the add Unseen. We took long enough lol...

At 2:46pm on August 30, 2013, Beth said…

Nice to meet you too!

At 4:25am on March 3, 2013, Gregg R Thomas said…

You Tyrant You.  LOL

Oh well at least we now have Richard Bohn, I wonder how long he will last. :D

At 10:33pm on March 2, 2013, Gregg R Thomas said…

Nice to be here, your thread got closed.

That's one of my pet peeves about Internet forums, the arbitrary overreaching invisible controlling hand.  But maybe it's just me...I gots me plentys of pets that peeves me. :D 


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