Women do not get raped because...

Views: 11214

Comment by Arcus on November 8, 2012 at 9:10am

@Strega: While most will see "provocative" clothing as just a girl taking advantage of her sexual capital, the signal rapists will receive is that she's "asking for it". This is where the danger lies, that the signal which is attempted to be communicated, and is correctly received by most, may be misinterpreted by those prone to it. Clothing is communication, and while the sender is not responsible for others misinterpretation, they should heed the danger of it happening.

Intoxication may increase the likelihood of ending up in a vulnerable position due to the reduction of critical reasoning, clothing may increase the likelihood of being targeted due to the signal effect.

Comment by Strega on November 8, 2012 at 9:14am

Then pick "drunk" and roll with it.  Or pick "wardrobe" and go with that.  What I am getting at is that the two do not belong together.  Both have a valid debate element, but the debate is different for each. 

Let me give you an example.  A person gets into a fight and gets arrested.  The newspaper reports that the arrested person was in possession of marijuana.  Now the implication here is that the pot-smoking had some bearing on the violence.  It subliminally links the two.

All I am saying is that if a woman goes out wearing short skirts and a low cut top, that is not an incentive to rape her.  She might be dressed like a tart, but if she isn't offering a financial transaction for sex, she should not be held responsible for the "uncontrollable urges" of a guy that lead him to rape her against her will.  She hasn't turned him into a rapist.

Being drunk is a whole different thing.

Comment by Unseen on November 8, 2012 at 9:17am

@Strega

All I am saying is that if a woman goes out wearing short skirts and a low cut top, that is not an incentive to rape her.  She might be dressed like a tart, but if she isn't offering a financial transaction for sex, she should not be held responsible for the "uncontrollable urges" of a guy that lead him to rape her against her will.  She hasn't turned him into a rapist.

Not parallel cases. A parallel case involving a male would be the guy who goes out and is constantly flashing a big money roll and then gets robbed as he leaves the bar for his car.

Or...maybe you don't see any irresponsibility in his behavior?

Comment by Unseen on November 8, 2012 at 9:19am

@Strega

And who said that the rapist's urges are uncontrollable? Not me or anyone else here, for that would release the rapist from responsibility for HIS actions, and that would be unfair to the victim.

Comment by Strega on November 8, 2012 at 9:47am

Actually if I extrapolate that argument, I would conclude that women would be safe from most rapes if they wore a burka. 

It is true that young women can dress to "display their wares".  I've heard of young men that stuff a pair of socks down their pants front to "display their wares".  There are laws in most places as to what constitutes "indecent exposure".  I don't think getting robbed is equivalent to getting raped.

I went looking for some stats on this subject, in particular because I wondered if the incidence of gay (male) rape was as high as that of heterosexual rape.  I found some here.  It's not a dry boring list, but it does indicate that only 4% of rapes reported in the USA are by strangers. Apparently only 1 in 4 rapes actually get reported, and also rapes leading to murder are not counted as rape, but as homicide.

I'm not trying to point fingers or accusations, please don't get me wrong.  I'm just trying to analyse the incidences with a view to understanding how perhaps we can improve the situation.  I just feel mind-altering substances might have a different cause and effect criteria than clothing.

Comment by Unseen on November 8, 2012 at 11:00am

 I don't think getting robbed is equivalent to getting raped.

You're thinking of the "give me your wallet" kind of robbery, not the getting beaten to within an inch of your life kind. THAT IS equivalent to getting raped because of the factor of being overpowered.

I'm not sure what your point is in bringing up male-on-male rape.

Comment by Unseen on November 8, 2012 at 11:07am

I went looking for some stats on this subject, in particular because I wondered if the incidence of gay (male) rape was as high as that of heterosexual rape.  I found some here.  It's not a dry boring list, but it does indicate that only 4% of rapes reported in the USA are by strangers. Apparently only 1 in 4 rapes actually get reported, and also rapes leading to murder are not counted as rape, but as homicide.

Does a girl looking for a Friday-night sexual adventure ("hook up") really regard the guy she has spent an hour talking to and dancing with a stranger? What is "stranger rape"? I suppose for most people it's the situation where a girl is dragged into the bushes or the dark alley by a TOTAL stranger. You may actually know someone for years and not know what's in their heart or in the back of their mind. Simply knowing someone for a while doesn't necessarily mean that they aren't a stranger to you. Maybe someone you've known for a while says or does something shocking and you realize that you really don't know them at all. Are they not strangers?

Comment by Strega on November 8, 2012 at 11:20am

Of course it is, Unseen - violence is violence and I support your point there.

Bringing up male rape?  No, I was just explaining why I went looking for stats.  The ones I found were much broader, and information ought to be helpful in our process of understanding.

I am trying to post whilst I think.  Probably doesn't help you much, because I don't think linearly.  However, it's the unfolding of ideas that triggers me to post, so I'm sorry if I leave you to unpick my postings, but without my curiosity, I probably wouldn't post at all.

I am over-viewing in my head and on this thread, the different causes for rape.  If there are several unrelated triggers that lead to rape, it might then be that we need several unrelated techniques to counter them. 

I feel drunkenness (or being high) is a different kind of trigger than appearance or clothing.  Not a better or worse one, just different.  I mentioned corrective rape in a much earlier posting (or maybe on a different thread). That is where lesbian women were raped to 'turn them straight'.  That's different too.  Education might address some of these triggers or actions.

I know you think rape is bad.  We all do - at least publicly!  And everyone who commits a crime is bound to search for an excuse to justify their actions.  Who wouldn't?  If this weren't the case, the Republicans wouldn't have got so pilloried recently over the term "legitimate rape".

Comment by Unseen on November 8, 2012 at 11:36am

I am over-viewing in my head and on this thread, the different causes for rape.  If there are several unrelated triggers that lead to rape, it might then be that we need several unrelated techniques to counter them. 

Let me say as far as "triggers" that I will never believe that a normal guy with a healthy attitude toward women can be "triggered" into committing a rape though he might find himself getting involved in a rape in a purely technical sense by misjudging the capability of the female to give sober consent or his own ability to make judgments despite being inebriated.

On the whole, there are guys with right attitudes and then there are a few potential rapists. The only potential part is that certain situations may seem to give them a "go." Unless you know of a so-called magic bullet to remove potential rapists from the scene, all some of us are saying is that it behooves a woman to beware and to be cautious OR to simply accept the risks involved.

Comment by Unseen on November 8, 2012 at 12:17pm

arch, I think it's called Oz.

Comment

You need to be a member of Think Atheist to add comments!

Join Think Atheist

Religion Virus

Services we love!

We are in love with our Amazon

Book Store!

Gadget Nerd? Check out Giz Gad!

Advertise with ThinkAtheist.com

In need a of a professional web site? Check out the good folks at Clear Space Media

© 2015   Created by umar.

Badges  |  Report an Issue  |  Terms of Service