The human cost

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Comment by Gallup's Mirror on September 23, 2013 at 3:07am

This is the list:

That's a partial list. I've added two important ones you left off:

I'm afraid to hold my boyfriends hand. [Fear of violence.]
My friends parents sent her away. [The destruction of family bonds and support.]
I found death threats in my locker. [Intimidation and harassment.]
I submitted to electroshock therapy. [Convinced that you're "sick" and torture is the cure.]
My grandmother sends me hate mail. [Generations of hatred and harassment within families.]
My school wont let me bring my boyfriend to the prom. [Institutionalized discrimination.]
>>I'm not here anymore. [Death due to murder or suicide.]
>>My father tried to beat it out of me. [Violence within families.]

Im sorry Gallup - Im still not feeling it. Is it dissapointment that these people have trouble dealing with?

I'm not sure what you mean, Angela. Is your apology for being unfeeling of compassion in general? Or for not feeling compassion just when it comes to "these people"? 

Comment by Gallup's Mirror on September 23, 2013 at 3:37am

kairan - as an event, whoever arranged that demonstration did a really lousy job. Its undignified and has very little impact.

As a lifelong activist, supporter of numerous causes and sometime participant in similar events in my younger days I can tell you: this is a fantastic community demonstration. One picture in the local paper or ten seconds on the evening news and a hundred thousand people read those signs. One picture on a major web site and millions could read them.

People respond to courage. That's exactly what it takes to stand in front of a crowd with a sign saying Dad beat me up for being gay.

It has nothing to do with my personal views on gay people for Petes sake.

Nothing never does, whatever your unstated "views" on them might be.

out of the 9 placards that I can read - only 3 of them fit the message.. Its just awful.

What is the message which you know and they missed? Enlighten us.

Comment by Unseen on September 23, 2013 at 12:19pm

@Angela - 

"I can't hold my boyfriend's hand" is just one of the posters. Then there is the one poster which is on an easel because the person who would be holding it committed suicide.

The problems with being gay hits teens harder than adults. Partly because teens are not yet equipped with an adult perspective and adult ways of dealing with and partly because they haven't yet built up a sense of who they are.

True, the problems of American and Western European gays may seem a bit pale beside those of gays in Africa and Russia, but that's no reason to give up on improving things.

Just in the last two weeks, there have been two major attacks on gays here in Cleveland and I'm sure attitudes here are not unique. This problem is far from being fixed.

Comment by Gallup's Mirror on September 23, 2013 at 1:09pm

and Im missing 1 more I think, what was it Gallup?

The point, Angela.

if someone can stand in a public place holding a sign announcing that they are gay and they dont get shot for it - then they dont really have a problem - do they?

"They" do. Mark Carson: shot dead in a public place for being openly gay. The tallest sign in the demonstration symbolically delivers a message from beyond the grave: "I am not here anymore."

Those problems are not exclusively homosexual issues guys. We all, heterosexuals too - face those problems just as much every day.

Heterosexuals don't face them because they are heterosexual. That's why "these people" are a minority group.

That's the point you're missing. Not for lack of clarity or having made it, but for your line-item discounts, omissions and dismissals. That's your prejudice cooking the books until each point becomes pointless to your satisfaction.

and the most insulting thing is when people - who have never experienced real adversity in their lives - trying to lecture people who have and then trying to tell them how to feel - FFS. How Rude.

It's not rude to shame you for portraying the fear, suffering and death of LGBT people as contemptibly unimportant. It would be ruder to let your boorish spectacle go unchallenged.

Rest assured, I don't do it for your benefit.

“The mind of a bigot is like the pupil of the eye. The more light you shine on it, the more it will contract.” - Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr. 

Comment by Cameron on September 23, 2013 at 1:53pm

Unseen and Gallup beat me to a few things.

Those problems are not exclusively homosexual issues guys.

We all, heterosexuals too - face those problems just as much every day.

Right, they're not exclusively homosexual issues.  However, when lgbt people face these issues because they're lgbt and heterosexual/cis-gendered people face them for various reasons that are not related to their sexuality or gender identity, then there's clearly something going on.

if someone can stand in a public place holding a sign announcing that they are gay and they dont get shot for it - then they dont really have a problem - do they?

Actually, yeah, they still do have a problem.  Apparently you can stand up at a demonstration or gathering and declare your sexuality and yet still be at risk for anti-gay violence.  In fact, looking at FBI hate crime statistics like these from 2011 will show you the risk of simply being gay.  In fact, as the Southern Poverty Law Center points out, The rate of anti-gay hate crimes versus the estimated percentage of total US population represented by lgbt people indicates that this group is more at risk for being victims of violence motivated by anti-gay bias.  And that doesn't even include stats about harassment and intimidation.

So if you want to talk about hardships being something experienced only in third world countries, then you're not paying attention to what's happening in the first world.

Comment by Warren on September 23, 2013 at 3:34pm

I think that anywhere, and in the US that if you wear or behave in some different way that someone takes exception to, for either possibly religious, macho, self-righteous or just being a prick reasons they make other people do what is "normal" whether we like it or not and they for these primitive reasons don't respect other people's rights.

Comment by Reg The Fronkey Farmer on September 23, 2013 at 4:04pm

I think it is a great demonstration.  We may not get the full sense of it from the photo. However if we were to walk past each sign, read it and look the holder in the eye the effect would probably be more profound, especially for those that seldom consider such issues.

It is always a serious issue if people have to take to the street for their human rights, especially when those same rights are enjoyed by the people that are homophobic towards them.

Sometimes the picture does say it better than words.

Comment by Diane on September 23, 2013 at 4:31pm

@ Angela - Wow.  I have wanted to make comments about several statements of yours over the months but I have restrained myself.  I looked at the picture and was deeply moved, feeling just a fraction of what those people must have gone through.  Quite the spreader of warmth and sunshine, aren't you?  I don't get it - You seem to have a need to be contrary and challenging when it does not seem reasonable necessary.  In this instance, it just seems callous and like more of what the people are holding up the signs for in the first place.  I tend to not make statements like this out of self-protection but this is just too much.  I guess you are entitled to feel how you feel and to express it, but I have to tell you much of what I've read coming from your keyboard makes me think, "What the &%#@?!"   

Comment by Diane on September 23, 2013 at 8:03pm

@ Angela - I get it that you just won't put up with crap.  I am similar in ways but I can't fight on every front at once.  I don't have that kind of time or energy.  I do admire people who stand up for what they believe in and speak their minds.  I guess we each have different points at which we draw a line in the sand.

Comment by Warren on September 23, 2013 at 8:54pm

BJ, "But what about individualism Frank?",

Major Burns, "Oh individualism is okay, so long as we all do it together"

Something like that on "MASH"

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