A Quick and Easy Guide to God. Your thoughts?

Comment by Heather Spoonheim on August 7, 2011 at 8:50pm

Where do you get this bit about 1/3rd of the angels asking for a kingdom of their own and Yahweh giving it to them?  You say a god (I'm assuming Yahweh) gave us a list of things we aren't supposed to do?  How do you know this?  What is the list?

 

If a god created us, then he either created us well enough to pass his test or not.  If not then it would seem he failed.  If yes then what is the point?

Comment by Dustin on August 7, 2011 at 8:51pm

Ummm.  I would argue that a Universe without evil but with free will can't exist if the people with the free will are the ones defining what they enjoy / like / find to be moral and what they don't enjoy / don't like / find to be immoral.  

 

With this line of thinking , you can actually argue that Heaven is just as evil if a Christian says 'sure you have free will in heaven' 

 

Then you can reply 'well what makes it any different than Earth where every person is always immersed in sin from morning to night'?  

 

But the rest of the chart is interesting .. 

 

 

Comment by Dustin on August 7, 2011 at 8:54pm

Also , if it just so happens that a Universe with free will but without evil is NOT possible , then this doesn't make God NOT all powerful , because if Evil is a necessary outcome of Free will , it's like saying God is not all powerful because God couldn't create a 'square circle' 

 

So I really think the Free Will argument doesn't work here.  It's much better to argue natural disasters and cruelty in the animal kingdom who don't have free will , tornadoes murdering babies who don't have free will, etc.  I honestly believe Free will and Evil are in fact 2 sides of the same coin.  

Comment by Liam P Burke on August 7, 2011 at 9:00pm

Heather,

How hard was this statement to understand?

he is all knowing, there is no need to test us because he already knows what you will do. However... You don't, and if you make it to heaven, you truly want to be there.

The answer is yes, and that is the point.

 

The bit about the third stems from the beleif that Lucifer, Micheal, and Gabriel were the three head archangels. Logic ditates that each would have an equal portion under them. Therefore a third.

 

Is it true? I dont know... Its a belief that seems to find its roots with Milton's "Paridise Lost"  and "Paradise Regained"

 

The list is simple to find... Pick up a bible. Actually read it, cover to cover, not bits and excerpts like most "good Christians"... It makes more sense than anything else I have found... Including atheism.

Comment by Stephen Walski on August 7, 2011 at 9:02pm

What makes you so sure i would want to be in heaven?

 

Are you sure that all of us want to be slaves of some nondescript being who decided to torture our species for eternity worshiping and praising it?  Sounds bad to me.

Comment by Dustin on August 7, 2011 at 9:06pm

@Liam   

 

Just because there might be 3   5-star Generals in the Military doesn't mean each of them has exactly 1/3 of the military under their disposal or under their control.  We don't even know if Lucifer , Gabriel or Michael were Totalitarian Angels, maybe it was a Democracy LOL!

Comment by Heather Spoonheim on August 7, 2011 at 9:07pm

"Logic dictates"?  What does 'logic' have to do with a fairy tale?  You might was well tell me that the most aerodynamic fairy should be 'self-evident'.  You cite Milton on this?  Your religion is based on Milton?  That's new.

 

I've read the bible cover to cover, a couple of times.  It's an interesting Bronze Age library documenting ancient mythology, some ancient history as interpreted so primitive superstitious minds, and a bunch of Jewish laws as well as some forged lineages to bolster the influence of certain kings.

 

If the bible sets forth a clear list of rules, then perhaps you could explain why Christians feel they are allowed to eat pork - is there a clear revoking of the pork prohibition?  If so, why would pork be prohibited for like 800 years and then kosher after Paul ran around telling stories about that Jesus character?

Comment by Stephen Walski on August 7, 2011 at 9:13pm
The fairies that are eating all the pork are not the most aerodynamic.
Comment by Heather Spoonheim on August 7, 2011 at 9:30pm

Anyway, Liam, let's think about your original statement here.  You say that Atheists can't conceive of anything greater than themselves.  Well, based on the evidence at hand, an Atheist realizes that earth is a fairly inconspicuous planet orbiting a tiny star with a bunch of other planets.  Our star is just one of billions in our galaxy, which is a very boring little spiral galaxy that doesn't stand out at all from the billions of others in the cosmos.  Nowadays we are finding evidence that our cosmos might not even be that special.  So there we are, living lives compared to a blink of an eye on the cosmological time scale, on a pale blue dot that wouldn't even constitute an atom on the lens of the cosmos (keeping with the eye analogy).  We know our own mortality and the finite nature of even our race.

 

Theists, on the other hand, think of themselves as the most glorious creation of their very own almighty imaginary friend who built the entire cosmos just for us.  You believe this in the face of zero evidence (and a LOT of evidence against) because you were indoctrinated to a cult that promised you an eternal life with your imaginary friend.

 

Now, which one of us is confused about our place in the world?

Comment by Liam P Burke on August 7, 2011 at 9:39pm

What makes you so sure i would want to be in heaven?

Absolutely nothing. And please.. tell me where I said you did?

 

What does 'logic' have to do with a fairy tale?

...

I've read the bible cover to cover, a couple of times.  It's an interesting Bronze Age library documenting ancient mythology, some ancient history as interpreted so primitive superstitious minds, and a bunch of Jewish laws as well as some forged lineages to bolster the influence of certain kings.

 

If the bible sets forth a clear list of rules, then perhaps you could explain why Christians feel they are allowed to eat pork - is there a clear revoking of the pork prohibition?  If so, why would pork be prohibited for like 800 years and then kosher after Paul ran around telling stories about that Jesus character?

Tell me this.... Why exactly would I try to explain something to someone so incapable of understanding it, that everything, (regardless of proof or lack thereof) is a myth, fairy tale or forgery?

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