Hello,

Someone sent me this video recently,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORvv3EY5E1o

it claims that god do exist.

How do you respond to that ?

Tags: facts, science

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It is the classic teleological “argument from design”. Both Christians and Muslims use the same arguments. They all use the same inept logic.

Here is a scientific statement therefore God exists!

This never proves anything. The claim is not the proof. Argument is not Evidence.

There are several errors in the presentation of the Science in the video. For example when stating that the distance from Earth to the Sun never changes. It does. That is why we have winters and summers!!

The narrator then says “If you realise these facts you will also realise that there is a merciful Lord (behind it all)…..” How can he make that deduction? Only by a leap of faith which he took years ago.

Even if you accept the scientific facts as being correct, how does that prove the existence of a God? Even if you were to accept that it might, how to you deduce it is a particular God?

It is also mentioned more than once that all this creation is just for us. How humble of the narrator. A whole planet created just for us. He then finishes with over 2 minutes of praising his God. Praising his God proves nothing.

So, in short, the narrator starts out already believing in his God and attempts through the abuse of Science to convince others that he is correct. It is all a claim with nothing to support it.

He also says that he has heard so much from the Atheists in the world and has now only figured out that they don’t believe in God!! He shows his ignorance and like most apologists for God he has to take a swipe at Atheism as if that somehow is relevant to what he is talking about. Overall it is rather third rate and not worthy of too much consideration.

Thank you,

"Argument is not Evidence" makes sense.

Reg

"the distance from Earth to the Sun never changes. It does. That is why we have winters and summers"

Strange that you would pick THIS "error" - the one thing the video has right. We have seasons because of the angle of rotation being 23.5 degrees - not because of the elliptical orbit. Otherwise the entire earth would have summer and winter at the same time.

Yes my bad...I know the correct reason but messed up and meant to link it to the burning or freezing of the planet if we were nearer to or further away from the sun. We are still not a constant 93m miles away from it though. Good to see no errors are tolerated!!

I believe that all the scientific information in the footage are correct and accurate, I posted just to know how do we respond to those who use these facts to claim that god exists

Hmmm. How about slowing the earth to 200mph (from 1000mph) extends the days and nights 10 times. Seems like pretty simple arithmetic - s/b 5 times.

More importantly the results (heat up in daytime till we burn and cool at night until we freeze) don't seem to take into account the mitigating effect of the atmosphere and oceans. Sure, temperatures would be more extreme, but, at a guess I'd say that a 60-hour day (& 60-hour night) would still have allowed life and natural selection to have taken place (although probably with very different results.)

Sorry. My comments are a bit off topic. It's just that, to me, science and faith are simply unrelated. You cannot prove scientific principles with faith any more that you can prove God using science. Unrelated. Different plains of thought.

The video was talking like "Lets Say", and also it isn't our main concern whether or not that is correct,

The footage is using science facts and figures mixed with some emotional words trying to reach fortunate people. and I think thats our main concern.

How do respond to someone who claims that science leads to god ?

Yes. I agree.

"How do respond to someone who claims that science leads to god ?"

Easy. Just get them to step through the evidence with reasoned scientific analysis. When they get to God, point out the fallacies. Fallacies will be present because, were God to be provable using science, then God would have to be a natural phenomenon rather than supernatural. Which means that, whatever was proven, it isn't God.

;-)

I guess, why not just let them get lost....

This is a common argument and proof that many believers present as to why they believe in their god. All the facts stated in the video are essentially correct and describe what we have learned about the earth and the universe. The video doesn't event mention the numerous physical values such as the the strength of the weak and strong force, gravity, the cosmological constant, etc. that are all of such values that by changing any one of them by a small amount would have resulted in a very different universe where life would not even be possible. (And just to be correct, the distance between the Earth and the Sun is NOT what causes changes in seasons (sorry Reg). It is the tilt of the Earth and the differences of solar heat that reaches the different hemispheres as the the Earth orbits the sun that is responsible for different seasons on the Earth).

All of this comes down to the argument that it seems that the entire universe is balanced perfectly to allow man to exist on Earth. Man is the most intelligent being on Earth. (here's where the leap of faith comes in). Man must be special and only an intelligent and benevolent god could explain why we are here.

When people realize how unlikely all these events and "finely tuned" values are, they conclude that it just HAS to be because an intelligent being designed it this way just for us.

To me this is a lack of imagination and just being lazy in their thinking. We (the human race) are here in this universe on this planet at this time. That is a fact. Why we are here and how it all happened is to be discovered. If any of the myriad physical values were different, if the Earth was not tilted, if the Earth was nearer to or farther away from the sun, if the Earth didn't have a large moon, etc. we simply would not be here to wonder. Humans don't exist on Mars, so there are no Martians to ponder their own existence.

Perhaps there is a planet around some distant star where it is far too hot for humans and life exists that depends on methane rather than liquid water. Suppose that this life form is sentient. It would probably also marvel at its own existence and thank some invisible sky god that created a world that that was perfectly hot and filled with methane in just the right proportions for the life forms to live.

We Earthlings are lucky to be here. Taking the leap that the universe was created just for us is simple arrogance and lazy thinking. I think this short narrative by Douglas Adams illustrates this kind of thinking very elegantly:

Imagine a puddle waking up one morning and thinking, "This is an interesting world I find myself in — an interesting hole I find myself in — fits me rather neatly, doesn't it? In fact it fits me staggeringly well, must have been made to have me in it!" This is such a powerful idea that as the sun rises in the sky and the air heats up and as, gradually, the puddle gets smaller and smaller, it's still frantically hanging on to the notion that everything's going to be alright, because this world was meant to have him in it, was built to have him in it; so the moment he disappears catches him rather by surprise. I think this may be something we need to be on the watch out for. We all know that at some point in the future the Universe will come to an end and at some other point, considerably in advance from that but still not immediately pressing, the sun will explode. We feel there's plenty of time to worry about that, but on the other hand that's a very dangerous thing to say.

the stupidity of this is making me feel nauseous.  This is why reason will never win in the 'god(s)' debate. 

things are 'created' the way they are because that's the way we need them

Vs.

We are how we are to adapt to out environment

I know which I believe, but I understand both points.  I think most atheists and free thinkers do.  I have seen time and time again though, that both sides of the debate can't or won't be understood by the types of theist that make this propaganda.  Once again, the debate is proving its self to be pointless

"Once again, the debate is proving its self to be pointless" I don't really agree with you.
if you could convince someone with such debate then you are saving a life from humanity illness that infecting many communities all over the world.

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