Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Tom Sarbeck on May 2, 2012 at 3:50am

Kristal, I enjoy xians making themselves look like fools, especially:

1. when they do it themselves without my help, or

2.when they don't know they are doing it.

To those who insist on doing their praying in public, I remind them  that Matthew in 6,6 tells them to pray in closets after they have closed the closet doors.

Religion will be with us as long as their leaders, instead of helping them deal with their fear, use it to manipulate them. Their leaders become wealthy and they, the fearful xians, remain poor.

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Permalink Reply by Noble9 on May 6, 2012 at 11:17am

You'll understand atheism, like any other "ism", only if it's relevant to you.  Otherwise why bother?  Ask Americans what Communism is and you'll get a lot of wacky answers.  If you're not an atheist and don't know any, why would you care about understanding it?

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Permalink Reply by Tom Sarbeck on May 7, 2012 at 1:58am

Thank you, Noble9, for the shot of reality you added to this discussion's wishful thinking.

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Permalink Reply by Tom Margolis on May 6, 2012 at 11:36am

Human minds did not evolve to be logical machines - cognitive bias is deeply embedded in the way humans think.  Belief in supernatural forces is, oddly, natural for humans; hence the need for a Scientific Method which helps us avoid cognitive bias.

So: People will always believe in the supernatural.  Some people's minds are more "susceptible" to supernatural thought than others - hence some people tend towards atheism more easily than others.  However, education can push people towards more-rational thinking:  Europe has a much higher % of agnostics and atheists than the U.S., and I suspect it's due to   1.) higher-quality, more-accessible public education, and  2.) cross-fertilization among diverse cultures (on a continent where most people speak multiple languages and it's easy to explore other nations and perspectives).

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Permalink Reply by Tom Sarbeck on May 7, 2012 at 1:47am

Tom, methinks Europe's centuries of religious warfare account for the higher % of agnostics and atheists there. They learned.

America won't have religious warfare like Europe's because we get rid of presidents after four or eight years.

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Permalink Reply by Tom Margolis on May 7, 2012 at 5:48am

> They learned.

Who is "they"? Babies aren't born with the lessons of history hard-wired into their brains. And the Middle East has had "centuries of religious warfare" and has a very low % of atheists.

You're positing a causal relationship with no control group, no evidence.  If the U.S. had lots of atheists, you could say "It's because separation of church and state is codified in our laws." If Europe had few atheists, you could say "It's because years of religious warfare have made people defensive and reactionary about their beliefs."  Your hypothesis sounds nice but is arbitrary - you basically picked a reason that feels good, without thinking about falsifiability or comparative social history (e.g. the Middle East).

On the other hand, falsifiable evidence from neuropsychology and anthropology clearly show that magical thinking is natural to humans.  Most people are born as magical thinkers, and will continue to think as such throughout their lives unless taught otherwise (and some never learn how to think rationally anyway).

I gotta say, all the comments on this site about how believers are stupid or lazy or scared reflects an embarrassing ignorance of human neuropsychology and cognitive bias, the real roots of magical thinking.

If you want to learn a bit about cognitive bias and the roots of magical thinking, see here:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cognitive_biases

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Permalink Reply by John Christian Lalor on May 13, 2012 at 3:31pm

I think with the advent of the inernet, people who question religion will now have a huge resource to find that they are not alone, 25 years ago, where could you go? It's only a matter of time, perhaps 40 or 50 years away when believers are in the minority.

It will happen, religion dedest knowledge.

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