Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Sassan K. on May 6, 2011 at 3:23pm

Nothing to do with Christianity. We make our decisions on rationality, not on religion. Bush's "freedom initiative" states that democracies are beneficial for U.S. national security as democracies do not engage in terrorism and terrorist activity and became active participators of the world. Democracies do not engage in war with other democracies.

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Permalink Reply by Albert Bakker on May 6, 2011 at 3:38pm

"Democracies do not engage in war with other democracies.." ain't that a line originally by Richard Perle?  Actually he said "Democracies don't start wars."

The conclusion is indeed inescapable that he's of the opinion the US isn't a democracy then, or Israel for that matter. Well okay, maybe he got a point there.

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Permalink Reply by Jim Minion on May 9, 2011 at 10:40am

Sassan, you don't remember Bush's I talked with god speech about going into Iraq and Afghanistan?

Sure, going into Iraq was a rational, freedom initiative.

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Permalink Reply by Arcus on May 8, 2011 at 3:40am

"Since then NO War that the US has been in has been justified in my mind."

Uf one subscribes to the assumption that overwhelming majority in the UN is sufficient justification, I think Kosovo and Bosnia were sufficiently justified. I also think think resolution 1773 justifies US intervention in (implicit declaration of war on) the government of Libya.

So at least SOME wars the US has been involved with has been sufficiently justified by some objective normative standard. Perhaps not ALL, but certainly not NONE.

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Permalink Reply by Cloudy on May 6, 2011 at 1:29am

Any act of torture voids the perpetrator of the torture of any merit, regardless of the cause.

Information can be obtained without torture, this isnt an episode of 24 or your stock hollywood action, there are many other professionals that can obtain information through more humane means.

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Permalink Reply by Heather Spoonheim on May 6, 2011 at 1:35am

[like]

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Permalink Reply by Sassan K. on May 6, 2011 at 1:38am

Cloudy, I am not advocating for such measures on a systematic basis or even a regular basis. All I am saying is that if every other method has failed (as Islam requires a certain amount of resistance before being able to confess and still go to heaven) then the authority should be on the table for a case-by-case basis determined by the commander-in-chief himself for non-U.S. Citizens who are not bound to our constitution and the Geneva Accords.

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Permalink Reply by Stanley Brooks on May 6, 2011 at 6:27am

I'm really disappointed to see a discussion such as this here. What has this to do with atheism or anything of that nature?  I'm sure there are many conservative website where you will find great support for your ideas.  And I believe the Geneva accords do not limit themselves to US citizens.  I believe it was Ben Franklin who said that those willing go give up freedoms to acquire security deserve neither freedom or security.  When you are willing to give up the rights of others you start on a very slippery slope.

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Permalink Reply by Heather Spoonheim on May 6, 2011 at 6:36am

Although Sassan has a superlatively minority stance on this issue here, it is a rather valid discussion in the context of Atheism.  Theists like to think they get their morality from 'on high', even if they do just have it dictated to them by the political leaders of their religion, but I think most Atheists consider it important to see morality defined in a much more democratic context such as public discussion.

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Permalink Reply by Sassan K. on May 6, 2011 at 11:28am

I have the likes of fellow atheists Christopher Hitchens' and Ayaan Hirsi Ali on my side; you have the likes of the scumbags George Galloway, Noam Chompsky, and Michael Moore.

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Permalink Reply by Big Fella on May 6, 2011 at 12:45pm

Argument from Authority, no explanation given, no context provided. What else is new?

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Permalink Reply by Reggie on May 6, 2011 at 12:50pm

Can you hear me rolling my eyes?  They are about ready to fall out of my head, which might spare me from seeing your awful logic any more.

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