I live in South Carolina. My local high school has a religious time released classes. My question is how are they getting away with this. I have included 2 links. The first is the website for the organization running the classes, the other, is a news article explaining a lawsuit in regards to classes. It has been upheld as long the classes do not "establish" religion. Based on the website for the organization, I would say they are in flagrant violation of the law. We need help in SC!
Interesting. Release time and community resource credits are things that have been around for a long time. As far as I know, schools in most states offer elective credit for academic work not taught in the district, including community college classes, internships, exchange credit with private and magnet schools, etc. Public colleges and universities teach courses on religion, after all, and kids can also get credit for courses at religious colleges/universities (Notre Dame, Georgetown, etc.)
In this case, it seems that the courses are being taught by state-accredited teachers, which would certainly seem to meet the test for giving elective credit, and release time is a well-established legal precedent.
Perhaps more important for atheist or non-participating students, this arrangement seems to be saving the school district quite a bit of money. That money is then available to support elective courses in science, humanities, etc. for the students who are not using release time. So one question you might want to consider is whether you're willing to give up a chance to take Advanced Placement Chemistry in order to make your fellow students sit in a class on poetry instead of leaving campus for an hour.
Beyond that very practical consideration, I suppose the question is whether it's OK to discriminate against other students because they are taking a religion class instead of a shop class. I have heard politicians argue that universities should only offer courses in sciences and engineering, because courses in literature are a waste of time and public dollars. Do we really want a precedent that the state should choose what people can elect to study? That kind of precedent can cut both ways.
They are doing it independently of the public school system. No tax dollars were used. In fact, tax dollars were saved to be used for the rest of the students who stayed behind.
They get graduation credit but not grades that count toward GPA. Any college/university/employer is just going to discount that credit anyway, much like any outside "fluff" elective. I have a younger colleague who got high school graduation/community resource credit for playing Dungeons and Dragons. Which, arguably, might be more intellectually stimulating than the Christian Learning Centers, but each to his/her own.
My problem with it is that it is not educating anyone about religion. It is a blatant attempt at indoctrination of children into one specific religion. The heading on the link “hundreds commit their lives to Jesus Christ!” makes that abundantly clear. I have no problem with the teaching of religion to children in a broader sense where they can learn about religions and all the different gods that other people believe in. That way they will grow up more opened minded and tolerant of diverse views and beliefs.
There are so many of these cases at the moment and it is good to see court action been taken as many Christians have no problem with ignoring the law of the land when it comes to pushing the theist agenda: capture their minds when they are young and you might keep them for life. It does not work so well on minds that have started to master critical thinking skills.
Junior school children in Ireland can now avoid mandatory religious indoctrination classes if their parents so wish. Atheist Ireland has developed a curriculum to teach about Atheism instead.
BTW the President of Atheist Ireland will be speaking in nearby N.C. in a few months’ time. I will link it in a future “Sunday School” article once I have more info.
It is a blatant attempt at indoctrination of children into one specific religion.
You did get the whole bit about these being electives and completely voluntary, right? Somehow I suspect that the participants have already been "indoctrinated."
I agree that in the U.S. the various Christian groups do constantly try to push the limits, and this is another edge case. That constant fighting over boundaries is the inevitable result of them feeling excluded and discriminated against. As much as some of us worry about religious indoctrination creeping in to mandatory schooling, they feel affronted by secularist indoctrination being pervasive in government-run schooling. Let's be honest, only upper-middle-class families can afford to "opt out" of public education in favor of private/parochial schools any more, so people are quite naturally looking to exercise their educational desires in any other way that they can.
The precedents cut both ways. If we want an atheist alternative in some places where instruction is primarily religious, it's natural for theists to want a theist alternative in places where instruction is primarily secular.
Hi Bob, How exactly are Christians being “excluded and discriminated against”? All we are asking for is to have freedom from religious incursions into education and politics. These are Rights guaranteed by the constitution. I find these regular claims of discrimination rather tedious. I am again reminded of Hitchens and the “Toy Story”
I do take your point about it being an “elective”. However that is where the choice ends because the only religion students get to learn about is the Jesus one and so it is further indoctrination. Would you think it a good idea to have chemistry as an elective and only teach about alchemy or only about polymers?
I think this needs some perspective:
- Atheism isn't an alternative; it is simply reality.
- the notion of 'secular indoctrination' is just nonsense.
The reason theists have been allowed to get away with this type of thinking is because atheists have stayed silent and anonymous for way too long.
The issue here is one of deception and dishonesty. Under the guise of teaching religion, these theists are on a mission to convert.