Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Kairan Nierde on December 14, 2012 at 9:46pm

This is an awful sentiment.  I feel sorry for the children and their parents too.  No person--Christian, Jew, Muslim, Atheist, etc.--should have to bury their child.  This is a terrible tragedy for all of us, but especially the families of the deceased!  They did not invite this violence upon themselves by being faithful. 

Phew, I am concerned that the anti-Christian sentiment on this website is going too far.  Joking about killing christians, calling them vermin, scapegoating them and forgetting that they are just as human as us--these are recent sentiments I have read from three different users.  It's been a few months since I got on TA regularly--what did I miss?

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Permalink Reply by Tom Pep on December 14, 2012 at 9:56pm

I do not want to see anyone hurt, I am a father myself, but before those people cry over the loss of their own children I hope they have cried over the loss of 100s of children by drones.

But was a a little mean, the truth is I am sorry for their loss, but I am so angry when people do not realise what loss is until it happens to them, maybe if people understood this more would stand up and say "No more killing!"

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Permalink Reply by Unseen on December 15, 2012 at 12:20am

What you're asking is inhuman. It's human to love one's own progeny over and above someone else's.

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Permalink Reply by BryanPaul on December 15, 2012 at 7:34pm

I don't think Tom is asking us to love anyone's kids. I think he's saying as Americans we tend to minimize the loss of people from other countries. We on this site should keep in mind that this is a world community. As an American I also believe we do so.

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Permalink Reply by Tom on December 16, 2012 at 5:31pm

'What you're asking is inhuman. It's human to love one's own progeny over and above someone else's.' 

You are right, of course, that we are genetically predisposed to favour our own kin, but this is not a good argument and is essentially a version of the naturalistic fallacy (that what is found in nature is good, not that of G. E. Moore). It is also human to be xenophobic, aggressive, selfish, cruel etc., but we suppress these natural instincts, although we can never be rid of them. Tom Pep's point is that we would do well to put aside our own selfish obsession with our kin (hard as this is) and consider that of others. I don't expect this to be achieved, but we should remember the naturalistic fallacy all the same.

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Permalink Reply by kOrsan on December 15, 2012 at 4:19am

maybe if people understood this more would stand up and say "No more killing!"

But they wont. Nobody gives a fuck about anybody else, until shit goes off in their own backyard. Then suddenly they want space and time to stop and everyone to feel sorry for them. It's human bias. Either cry for every soul or stop being a hypocrite and don't expect people to show you sympathy.Thousands of kids die every day of war, famine, disease. But people choose to cry and moan over those that make the news only. But if you point that out, they'll get a hissy fit over you being so insensitive. If I walked up to someone on the street and said "18 children died yesterday of starvation in a small village in Africa" they wouldn't even bother reacting. Apparently different lives have different values.

Tens of thousands of new babies were born since the shooting.

Humans are expendable.

Life isn't sacred.

Children aren't special.

Get over it.

Sit back and let the media milk and rape this story for a week or two. Just can't wait for all the gun control, violent video games and bullying babble to start all over again. Not to mention all the clergymen who are going to be all over this story trying to proselytize, like vultures feasting on a carcass.

And after that it's forgotten anyway, until next year when it comes up during the anniversary in a 5 minute news segment.

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Permalink Reply by Tom Sarbeck on December 15, 2012 at 11:02pm

Tom Pep, you've made clear that drones killing children stir your emotions. Fine, use the energy your emotions give you to tell Obama, and to move others to tell Obama.

Don't use your energy to invalidate the concerns of others for children much closer to them.

Do you really want parents to feel as strongly about children they don't know as they feel about their own children?

Do you feel more strongly about children killed by drones than you feel about your children?

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Permalink Reply by E.J. Solomon on December 14, 2012 at 11:45pm

I understand your point Tom but that's just how all people are. All of us don't know exactly what any particular experience is like until we experience it for ourselves. Who knows, maybe some of these parents will champion some sort of cause for children now that they've had this horrific experience. There's a lot of suffering in this world so you cant hold it against someone for not knowing about any specific form before they come across it.

I feel so sorry for these children and their families. I don't mind if they pray or take comfort in their faith. Carl Sagan said it best, "If it takes a little myth and ritual to get us through a night that seems endless, who among us can not sympathize?". Live it let live. Religious or nonreligious, lets keep these families in our hearts and minds as well as the any other families who are experiencing similar circumstances who don't get as much media attention.

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Permalink Reply by Tom Pep on December 15, 2012 at 1:44am

I am as guilty as many others, up until a couple of days ago I was preparing for the holiday, chatting with my family, talking about visits, oblivious to the outside world, I suspect in a couple of weeks like the rest of the world this will be just another tragic story for me, and that's what bothers me.

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Permalink Reply by Kairan Nierde on December 15, 2012 at 2:14pm

Hey, Tom.  It doesn't have to end with the news story.  If you want to make this tragic story into something more than that, act on your feelings.  Help change our violent culture.  There are people already trying to do this who you can join. 

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Permalink Reply by Tom Sarbeck on December 15, 2012 at 11:08pm

Right on, Kairan! Few people become politically active until they FEEL something.

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Permalink Reply by Amanda Mrakovich on December 15, 2012 at 12:12am

I have to agree with you. I was shocked and so saddened by the events today but I couldn't help thinking how misguided when I hear "our prayers are with.." or "may god..." then there was a priest on the tv...I had to turn it off, for many reasons. 

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