Hi everyone,

First of all I'd like to say that I am new here so sorry if this post is in the wrong section!

Secondly, I know that this is a, "ahhh not that again", type topic, but I could really do with some advice on the subject. I am no scientist and I am by no means very experienced when it comes to the whole bacterial flagellum debate. I know the 'basics' and the argument on both sides of the fence.

I have been having this debate with a friend lately and I felt that this had been put to bed and debunked. However he has pulled out Demskis response to Millers claim that: "if the flagellum contains within it a smaller functional set of components like the TTSS, then the flagellum itself cannot be irreducibly complex – by definition. Since we now know that this is indeed the case, it is obviously true that the flagellum is not irreducibly complex."

Here is Millers article, debunking the bacterial flagellum theory of irreducible complexity.

http://www.millerandlevine.com/km/evol/design2/article.html

And here is Demskis counter argument or reply to Millers:

http://www.designinference.com/documents/2003.02.Miller_Response.htm

His main argument against me is this, and I am quoting my friend directly:

"My point: Evolution currently has no explanation for how either the TTSS alone or the Flagellum itself evolved, so how in the world can one simply assume as much? It's crazy.

Sure, if one's background is rooted in evolution, one will look for evidence to support that view; but claiming gradualism when in fact they have no clue as to the nature of how it evolved is just plain lunacy??"

I am not asking anyone to read through the entire articles or really go out of their way. I'm just hoping there are a few people here who know about the subject and have recent findings or articles I can point my friend to, in order to get my point across that the bacterial flagellum is no longer a sound argument against evolution.

I thank you in advance for any replies and I look forward to learning more about this topic!

-Remy