Inquiring Christians want to know.... What do you think about us?...and Why?

I really want Christians to HEAR what YOU think of them....good, bad, or ugly.

Brief stories and examples would be most helpful for them to understand your perspective.

Since most Christians won't visit ThinkAtheist to read it, please submit your comments via this site: http://tinyurl.com/245dov5. If you don't use my site...that's fine too...it will just take me longer to read through and summarize the points.

Some disclaimers:

I am not here to attempt to save your soul or preach to you. I'm not here to set you up or attempt to trap you. I don't have any ulterior motives.

My mission is to help Christians live what we preach. Among other things...to love one another...and that includes atheists and non-believers. I want us to coexist. We can't do that if Christians are adding fuel to the fire and visa versa. We must seek to understand and respect each other if we are to coexist in peace.

Again, I'm not trying to change YOU...I'm trying to change Christians...for everyone's benefit.

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I'm happy to know I've started a discussion worthy of so much activity.

I just wish I was getting more posts on this site: http://tinyurl.com/245dov5

I want OTHER Christians to know what you think.

So, with your permission, after a while I'll have to go through all the posts and summarize them (anonymously) for inclusion on my site. When I do, I'll add a note to this thread, and if anyone objects with my characterization..you can let me know so I can edit it and correct it as necessary.

I
I can understand you want other Christians to know what we think...

.. but from my point of view, I find myself asking "Why bother?"

Other Christians don't care what we think. I doubt you really do either. Changing the "face" of Christianity is sort of like covering a turd in candy for me (sorry). Deep down inside, it is still the same disgusting bullshit.

You want my opinion, I don't mind giving it. I'm not just a militant atheist talking out of her ass either, I am a former Christian of a very long decade, and a former Pagan before that -- I was raised Agnostic meaning I made those religious choices all by myself without anyone pushing them on me, in some misguided attempt to find "the higher purpose" (which doesn't exist, by the way).

My honest opinion of Christianity, having -been- a Christian, is simple: Christian or not, being religious simply means choosing ignorance. "Faith" is just another term for ignoring reality.

For the record, "Ignorant" and "Stupid" are not equated in my book. Christians can choose to be ignorant yet still be very intelligent. I don't want to toot my own horn, but I've always been an intelligent individual... and yet I still got sucked into Christianity for a time. That is the nature of how cults (and I consider all religions on some level to be of cult-like influence) affect on the mind of some people more than anything... I admit I was just weak.

The long and the short of it is: Religion = Ignorance. So why would other Christians want to hear this? It doesn't change anything. They aren't all of a sudden going to realize "Hey, she's right!" and they also aren't going to -change- anything.. because changing religion essentially means admitting it is wrong to begin with, and therefor makes religion moot anyway.

Religion is ignorance and that is all there is to it -- and that also includes me in my past. I don't sit here and claim to not have been ignorant myself. I was... gravely so.

I don't feel I need a "brief story" to go into it, though I've probably to some degree given one.. on the one hand, that which can be asserted without proof can be denied without proof; but on the other, there is a ridiculous amount of proof that the Bible was nothing but mythology and manufactured at best, a plagiarized mash-up of already existing faiths and ideas from centuries ago and they too were all false to begin with.

Christianity is just another mythology that, sadly, gets passed down from adult to child and the mind of a child is designed to believe what the adult tells them.

But as time goes on, the amount of people breaking free from religion grows and grows with each generation.. eventually, though not in my lifetime, religion will be gone from this Earth.

Sad I'll never see the day.

I'm happy to post this on your site -- but again I tell you: What's the point? I see none, to be honest. But there you have it anyway.
I must disagree - there can be change. It probably won't cause theists to slap themselves on the foreheads and exclaim "of course". But if there is a little nagging doubt in the back of their head then everything enforcing that doubt can build up and lead to change.

You can't take down the wall religion has built about the mind with dynamite, but you can erode the cement holding it together one chip at a time.
Let me rephrase that for you - the anger found in the atheist community is not from a lack of god's presence, it's from the overabundance of the presence of those who believe in him. Especially in places they have no business being.
George, first, thanks for being brave enough to share what you shared in this public forum. I DO hear what you are saying. I can't apologize for everyone else that has mistreated you or taken away your rights. I truly am working to correct that....and I'm quite sure it will take my entire life...but I'm fighting for tolerance and acceptance within the church. I want us to be able to live peaceably together.

So, all I can do is work to lead those around me, and encourage other christians to lead others to LIVE what we preach (unconditional love and acceptance of others). Trust me when I say it pains me that christians, the "religious right", have done the opposite. Instead of holding up a mirror and looking at our own "sin", we too often put a spotlight on someone else. It's not right...and it's not "Christian".

Through all of these discussions, I AM gaining empathy. George, you've done what I was hoping this discussion would do...give crystal clear feedback that I can take and share in the hopes of one day making a positive difference in this world. Thanks.
"When I accepted the possibility of a God, I asked God for a sign/miracle to prove to ME that he was there, and he gave it to me. From there, my searching and studying lead me to the most valid answer...Jesus Christ and Christianity."

Just out of curiosity Brad, what was this sign/miracle?
Doug, I know you may be curious...but please believe me when I say that this is not the right venue to share it. I would only be clobbered for sharing it. I've shared more personal things in private emails, only to find them published on these public forums. So, I hope you'll understand my reasoning for not sharing here.
No, I don't!
Seconded. I'm anxious to hear Brad's replies to the few points I've raised, too.
WC, thanks for your continued hospitality. It's not as common here as I was hoping. But I guess It should be expected. If an atheist joined some theological seminary forum...God help us...I don't imagine it would be very welcomed. It should be...but probably wouldn't go well.

To answer your question (to the utter joy of many on this site I'm sure)...I can't prove to you that God created matter or anything else. Nor can anyone on this site prove that God doesn't exist. You can model the big bang on a computer...but you still can't prove how or why it happened spontaneously.

We both look at the universe, see it from our own perspectives and filters. We can both look objectively at everything that DOES exist and still can't prove how it came into existence.

I don't say (as others has suggested) that since I can't explain it...it "must" be God. I and a whole lot of Christians, muslims, jews, hindus, etc.. have experienced something beyond what is observable or scientifically provable....that is proof enough to us that something bigger than us is at work...and we call it God. In other words, we place our faith in a creator God...based on our spiritual or supernatural personal experience with God...not simply because we can't explain it or prove it.

You mention that answering questions begins with an observation of the physical world. But there's where I slightly disagree. I say to answer the questions...look at ALL the possibilities (God/supernatural + the observable world). You say it's an anomaly why the universe exists. I agree. it is! Isn't the existence of such a universe just incredibly marvelous and profound to ponder? It's SOOOO big, it begs the question...how is it even possible? I don't look at it and say "since I can't understand it....it must be God"...I look at how marvelous it is and say that it's simple existence implies the existence of a mysterious and ubiquitous God. It's a subtle difference...but it's a real difference. (at least to me).
Why would we want to do that? You are the one who comes up with the incredibly unlikely explanation for the existence of the universe and our awareness of it. It's your show.

Ha! You completely right. Nowadays, every new theory has to go under scrutiny and either disprove or compliment that which we already know. Somehow religions got in before we installed this standard and now were stuck with them. Christianity would be hard done to have started up in todays world.
Quite correct. I forgot about Scientology ( I almost feel insulted that they would choose that for their name; ) I feel as if I have held the majority humanity in too high a regard.
Never underestimate the power of non thinking.


To compliment, "Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups."

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