i need some help in how to respond to my older sisters religious bs
she has thrown in my face that i am huring mom b/c i don't believe and i refuse to go to church
i moved back home to take care of her b/c of she has cancer.
my older sister and little sister are coming on easter and they are all expecting me to go to church, do i go agaist my values and go or not go?

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yeah, it's not like ancient humans had much left to look forward to after 32 years of age anyway besides a miserable decline during what we now call middle-age followed by an early death. So the Jesus figure missed out on the worst years of mortal human life to skip of into heaven? Good deal!

Interesting that apparently he didn't preach until he hit that age, either.

Christians will torture their chronology to make the gospels compatible with each other when you read the sequence of events (coming up with three distinct incidents with the moneychangers at the temple for example, in order to reconcile John with the synoptic gospels) but it looks like he was only preaching for a few months before getting crucified.

That's because his alleged ministry didn't begin until after his baptism.

Regarding the gospel of John, supposedly the son of Zebedee, the fisherman, he didn't even meet Yeshua the way the synoptic gospels say he did. According to him, there was no "fishers of men" incident. Those guys should have gotten their stories straight.

Yeah, good point.  Plus, if you believe the prevailing fable (quite open to interpretation and revision), he had no wife or children.  The "starting a religion thing" wasn't working very well judging from the fact the Romans never even mention him and they were record keeping fanatics.  Maybe he understood that just as any painter's pictures are worth more after they are dead,  he might as well check out and go into retirement.

Heck, most of his 12 buddies were luke warm about him.  It wasn't until decades later when those 4 fiction writers got the book rights to his life that things took off.  Now we have movies and all sorts of entertainment. : )

Right - the first, "Mark" wasn't written until more than 40 years later - who waits 40 years to write a book about the "savior of the world"?

None of the four gospels were signed, it wasn't until the second century CE that a group of Bishops arbitrarily decided that Mark, Matthew, Luke and John wrote them,

It wasn't until 325 that it was decided, officially at least, that the "trinity" existed, and that Yeshua was a third of it. There were also divided opinions as to whether Yeshua was born the son of god from a virgin, was born normally and was adopted by god at his baptism, or became divine upon his resurrection. These are all decisions that were eventually made by committee.

Ah, the Trinity!  Now was there ever a more convoluted, schizophrenic mishmash of mambo-jumbo?   Talk about multiple personality disorders.  Well he is, no he isn't, yes he is.  Oh, I got it, let's say he is and is part of a three-some and we'll throw a ghost in there to boot. 

I suspect they will have to retreat from this position in the future as people start to ask the inevitable questions.  The poor obsessive/compulsives will miss the incessant signing of the cross. 

I remember when they tried to bring it more main stream and said it's not a ghost, it is a spirit.  I suspect Trinity will go the way of limbo (remember that one) and the dodo bird. 

RE: "But we know there was no Adam and Eve so no original sin and no reason to make up the rest of this unbelievable story."

Exactly - yesterday someone (I don't have time to look up who) commented that we should ignore the Old Testament and concentrate on the New, but I disagree, the OT is where all the provable bullshit is, and the NT proves that Yeshua (Jesus' real name) believed the OT, hook, line and sinker, which in turn proves there was nothing "divine" about him, if he ever existed, he was just another gullible fool who - again, if he ever actually existed - died for absolutely nothing.

Which is why the catholic church treats the OT as an inconvenient book and distances themselves from it as far as they can. Perhaps they have read some of your work Arch.

Why do you think the Pope quit --?

That is a good question.  I have no idea myself but the speculation ranges from his increasing infirmity to embarrassment over his handling of abuse cases in the past.  With the world growing increasingly more outraged by the stories of cover-ups and the Pope being implicated in many of them, Vatican City provides him with sanctuary from prosecution.  He can't be extradited from there.  I think a cardinal Britain was recently outed for inappropriate behavior.  If they have the balls to go after a cardinal, maybe the hand writing was on the wall.  This could have been a face-saving preemptive strike by the Church or negotiated exit by the Vatican and legal authorities in Germany. 

Then there are those who feel they have to modernize before there is no one left to turn off the lights.  He stood in the way of that and he put his foot in his mouth a number of times.  How does someone who is infallible do that?

Geoff, I'm sure the Pope is every bit as infallible as the Bible is, inerrant.

my issue with religion is the lies they tell...I have gone to church with my ma while I have been here but got tired of listening to the lies.  When I first started going I would leave during the sermon and now when I am not working I just drop her off and come home. 

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