Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Misty: Baytheist Living! on May 28, 2010 at 11:53am

So I'm going to skip all the drama that this argument stirred up, and go right to the black and white.

1) Gay couples don't procreate by accident.
2) Gay couples are more likely to have two income families.
3) Gay couples are more likely to be socially aware.

Now, I'm not saying that all parents love unplanned babies any less, I am saying there are cases where unplanned pregnancies create a much more stressful environment and the possibility of financial strain. I will even go as far to say that unplanned pregnancies are more than likely to be the target of resentment from both parents, too. When gay parents become parents, they do so because the want to.
Likewise, I'm not saying that being poor means you'll be a bad parent, but when it comes to providing for your children, statistics are very clear that the correlation of poverty, education and health are pretty damn black and white.
Further, growing up in a minority household will go a long way to providing a more cultured, tolerant mind.
So what I'm saying here is that all facts point to the conclusion that children raised by gay parents should be more educated, culturally aware and healthier, over all.

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Permalink Reply by Joe O'Brien on May 28, 2010 at 3:52am

I'd be happy to get rid of all marriage. And that picture of Kinsey doesn't look anything like Liam Neeson.

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Permalink Reply by Cara Coleen on May 31, 2010 at 10:11am

I'm sorry; I just don't believe marriage is an institution so sacred it can't be improved upon. I believe that we can make amendments to what it is and/or what it entails. No person enters a marriage thinking they're going to divorce that person, but there is a lot that can happen that would make a person want to seek a divorce. There is also no reason not to let two people enter a marriage that want a marriage though they're the same sex... except if we're just obsessed with tradition and propriety. A homosexual couple's marriage will not diminish the sanctity of a straight couple's marriage, or cheapen it.

You and I obviously come from different parts of the world; I'm sure there are things that we'll never be able to relate to each other on. That being said, I simply do not comprehend your defensiveness when it comes to marriage since you're atheist. Marriage is a religious institution, but that doesn't mean the concept of marriage must remain a religious institution. It doesn't mean a nonbeliever can't enjoy the benefits of marriage or draw up the contract of marriage in a way they feel is the most advantageous for both parties.

You say research has proven marriage to be a successful institution, but what do you regard as "success"? If the marriage lasts until one or both parties have deceased, is that considered successful? Were people polled and asked how content they were? What are these studies based on? Do they take into account the experience of men and women? Is there a possibility the participants would feel inclined to answer a certain way even if they felt differently? Is this a global study? Are the opinion's of the married couple's children taken into account? Are all demographics counted?

Since marriage is a global tradition, I would say it's impossible to really gauge the success of marriages across the board. To say marriage works in one part of the world therefore marriage works is a very liberal conclusion, and also presumptuous. I just don't think it's something that can be accurately measured, and (again) I don't think marriage has to be so black and white. Our world is progressing, and its traditions can progress as well.

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Permalink Reply by Cara Coleen on May 31, 2010 at 11:38am

Well, I'd first like you to link to to these studies you're referring to... or let me know how they're gauging the "success" of marriage. Also, I believe that the "parameters by which happiness is measured" are relative. I think it would be difficult for either of us to prove to the other who was happier. Is happiness what constitutes as a successful marriage anyway? That's my biggest question.

Besides, I'm not against marriage; I never said I wouldn't get married. I'm also not homosexual, so I don't have to fight for my own right to be happy with the partner I choose; I'm already with him and we may or may not get married.

I just don't think it's fair that other people are denied what would make them happy! I would never deny you the right to marriage; I would never deny you the right to conduct your marriage the way you saw fit. If you feel marriage is a life-long, nonnegotiable contract, then by all means... enter therein!

My only real position in this debate is that people should be able to marry whomever they choose and that it's no one's business but theirs. If two consenting adults choose to marry, that's their prerogative; if they choose to divorce, that's also their prerogative. "Selfishness" is not the only reason marriages end. My mother divorced my father because he left her and began relations with other women. He was not the one to file for divorce though he was the unhappy party! My mother loved him but knew she couldn't remain married to him. I suppose self-preservation is selfish, but it's also necessary.

I just think people are too concerned about what other people are doing, even when it doesn't affect them. Like I said, I would never deny you what you feel is an appropriate marriage; I just wish you would not try to deny other people what they feel is appropriate.

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Permalink Reply by Skycomet the Fallen Angel on June 1, 2010 at 10:47am

No Flame Wars Please!!

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