Prolife? Pro-choice? Me I am a new middle ground I call Pro-DECISION

Okay heres my thought on abortion please don't flame me to hard...but I hate abortion yet I can allow for abortion when it harms the mothers life I am fine with that but frankly I don't like abortions. Heres why: See as many on here I accept evolution and I accept the earth being 4.5 billion years old. So that would mean I am a long struggling process of 4.5 billion years of evolution just to get to me...thats reason 1 my biggest reason reason 2: Richard dawkins once said "We are the lucky ones because we are going to die...Most people are never going to die because they are never going to be born at all.." Frankly I want everyone to be just lucky enough to be born. Reason 3: life is short and this world though not perfects is so ...wonderfully made wonderfully formed... I want as many people to see it not to mention the stars the planets the other galaxies the hubble pictures ECT ECT. I want them to learn science to learn their orgins their true orgins and I want them to find their own path and follow their dreams.

Which is why I am pro DECISION: I dont like abortion but I allow that it is not my DECISION however I would like said person that is NOT having medical birth problems to make sure they have an INFORMED EDUCATED DECISION. I guess...it kinda is prochoice....but I ....am also pro life which is why I kinda had to make something new....

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I want as many people to see it not to mention the stars the planets the other galaxies the hubble pictures ECT ECT

Including thousands of children who are sold into prostitution because their parents can't feed them? Shall we pop out as many babies as possible so that these child prostitutes can look up at the stars inbetween their tricks with old men?

I am a long struggling process of 4.5 billion years of evolution just to get to me

Yes...billions of creatures ate each other and starved to death and struggled throughout millions of years of Earthly organic evolution so that mothers would be obliged to give birth to children they don't want in a time in their lives when they aren't ready to have children.

wonderfully made wonderfully formed

You mean children with very serious physical and mental defects who will only live a week or two struggling to breathe? Shall we expect a mother take such a baby all the way to term just to watch it die when she might terminate, grieve, heal and try again? There is nothing wonderfully made nor wonderfully formed in this case. It

Frankly I want everyone to be just lucky enougwould prefer to start over again to be born.

One child can be born now...or a different child could be born one or two years later when their parents are ready to take care of it, give it the love and attention it needs and provide for them. There may be a few less people on Earth but think quality over quantity (within reason).

Including thousands of children who are sold into prostitution because their parents can't feed them? Shall we pop out as many babies as possible so that these child prostitutes can look up at the stars in between their tricks with old men?

Red herring  =-= straw man fallacy I was trying to make something wonderful sounding and you try to turn it into shit? Rude...Still...thats not what I said at all I am saying that those who are able to make it to be alive should try and enjoy it and try and get the chance to see what we have come to know and see =-=

Yes...billions of creatures ate each other and starved to death and struggled throughout millions of years of Earthly organic evolution so that mothers would be obliged to give birth to children they don't want in a time in their lives when they aren't ready to have children.

Again red herring, yes this is true yes this happened but that was before we had the knowledge and the means to make it better....still I am not talking about rape here I didn't even mention rape...take on my arguments not putting in your own just because you don't like my stance.

You mean children with very serious physical and mental defects who will only live a week or two struggling to breathe? Shall we expect a mother take such a baby all the way to term just to watch it die when she might terminate, grieve, heal and try again? There is nothing wonderfully made nor wonderfully formed in this case. It

Thats just sad yes....but I still say this world is wonderfully formed have you been to grand canyon or niagra falls I was talking about TOPOGRAPHY. Also I am not fo\rcing the mothers to do anything also how does this change anything if they die HEALTHY after they are born or how does this change if they dont know they are unhealthy till after they are born? Your post here...just doesnt make sense.

One child can be born now...or a different child could be born one or two years later when their parents are ready to take care of it, give it the love and attention it needs and provide for them. There may be a few less people on Earth but think quality over quantity (within reason).

I agree but again this is THEIR DECISION I am merely arguing my stance on the subject.

Red herring =-= straw man fallacy

Be careful when you call people out on fallacies. A straw-man is when someone mis-characterises your position. I didn't do that. I gave examples which show how your overly happy and optimistic view of the world and evolution is not always the case in the real world.

It is certainly not a red-herring. I am not distracting away from your argument but...again...showing examples of what's wrong with your argument (that it is too simplistic and general and not particularly sophisticated).

all I am saying that those who are able to make it to be alive should try and enjoy it and try and get the chance to see what we have come to know and see

Okay great. I agree. What does that have to do with abortion?

still I am not talking about rape here I didn't even mention rape.

Neither did I. What are you talking about?

I was trying to make something wonderful sounding and you try to turn it into shit?

You can make any argument sound as nice as you like...that doesn't make it a good argument. Christians try to argue that God must have created the universe because it's so beautiful. That we must praise God so that we can take advantage of every wonderful opportunity we have. That is total happy-land-garbage.

Rude

If you want people to agree with and tell you how wonderful your poetic joy for the world is...then submit your narratives to a creative writing club. However if you are going to try and combine an argument against abortion with your poetry you are not going to get sugar coated responses.

I am merely arguing my stance on the subject.

Yes and I'm showing you some big problems with your stance.

I was talking about TOPOGRAPHY.

If that's what you meant you should have made that clearer.

have you been to grand canyon or niagra falls

I've seen Niagara falls and a whole lot more. It's nice. Very awe inspiring though it is awe inspiring because we have evolved to find certain features beautiful...some of them so beautiful that it takes are breath away. That doesn't mean that these features were "meant" to take our breath away. They are certainly nice. Perfect though? How can a topography be perfect except in an incredibly subjective way.

how does this change anything if they die HEALTHY

What?

Your post here...just doesnt make sense.

I can make very little sense out of some of your responses.

I agree but that doesn't mean we should stop having kids nor does it mean we shouldn't try and give the future generations a chance...I agree its not perfect I agree that we should do something about it. I agree that we are a large species....but that doesnt change my stance one bit....Because lots of people die daily and theres nothing I can do about it..I am mostly trying to make sure the human species continues to the point our future generations can see other worlds...other galaxies if possible.....I want our race to become like star trek boldly going where no man has gone before....sure I wont be there....but someone from my genetic line might be....

I am meerly saying that I dont...like abortion but I respect that it is not my choice...I just want those who are NOT IN PAIN like those who are just going to get rid of a baby because they arent ready to consider adoption or something....foster care.....I want them to be INFORMED of other options because no child should be aborted because of selfish unready parents....

In order: Agree, disagree ish kinda a fetish is still..kinda child in my book but its hard for me to say when it becomes such.... Also so what if it doesn't feel pain? People on death row dont feel pain does that make killing them not wrong? What about dogs that are put down? What about assisted suicides? Still I agree mostly with this statement.

Never said anything about high population levels...didnt even discuss population but I agree 

I was talking about progeny, children I doubt its in the cards either as I kinda plan to adopt....but still...I dont want the human race to just...go out with a whimper as we blow ourselves up ...but with a bang as we work towards finding a way to explore the universe.

True to all of this...still question how do you KNOW a fetus doesnt feel pain? I agree it probably doesnt...though this hasnt changed my stance this discussion not one but but.... I do guess its prochoice...and a prolife stance I hold...its hard holding both...yet not totally now after this discussion...but I still hold both and agree abortion doesnt really affect much seeing as its 1 kid vs the 9 million dying each year before the age of 5 due to reality problems.

In the case of abortion, a foetus has no way of knowing what is happening or what it implies.

Isn't that also true of murdering an infant, or even a mentally handicapped adult?

Or a comatose or sleeping person.

nice ^^

Your death as a human being occurs with the cessation of your higher brain functions and the irreversible end of your consciousness: 'brain death'.

+1

I'm pro choice in a very big way. However, that means choice, honest choice. What is this special information you'd like a woman to consider which might stop her abortion intentions?

As far as wanting as many lives as possible on the planet, to watch the stars or contemplate the majesty of the universe, by inference your argument could extend to prohibiting contraception, and not allowing anyone to purchase a condom without making sure they understand they will be denying a child who can stargaze, etc.

Well Iw ant them to think of the fact of what if their parents had aborted them about all the stuff they would miss out on. I want them to have other options such as foster care and adoption rather than aborting a child regardless of the stage its in.

I did not say as many lives as possible and no contraceptions dont apply because they are not IN THE PROCESS of having a kid =-= I am meerly talking about those who are wanting to abort again this is their choice....I am sorry that I used stargazing but....I like doing it and I want others to see the stars....that doesnt mean contraceptives should come into this as I am only talking about ABORTION.

But if I may yes I guess...your kinda right but I still disagree because there is no child there...sperm hasnt met egg still..I guess...your kind right...idk I will think on this further....

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