Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Teri G on December 27, 2011 at 9:04am

Ok, I understand.

Permalink Reply by Ceci on January 2, 2012 at 7:40am

is there any difference? i don't think so,
 it's only sophistry. 

Permalink Reply by erik112358 on January 2, 2012 at 7:49am

Sophistry?  No.  Splitting hairs, maybe.

Permalink Reply by Ceci on January 3, 2012 at 4:42am

so can you explain me this difference? i've listened to a thousand discussions about 
it and nobody has been able to give me a
 good answer so far.

Permalink Reply by Unseen on January 3, 2012 at 10:56am

Sophistry=insincere argumentation and/or deceptive reasoning. Splitting hairs=arguing by relying on abstruse technicalities.

Permalink Reply by Ceci on January 4, 2012 at 4:02am

i didn't mean the difference between sophistry and splitting hair
but between the claim that there is no god and rejecting the claim that there is a god,
as i explained in my previous message.

Permalink Reply by Kir Komrik on January 7, 2012 at 5:23pm

Ceci,

 

The principled difference here can be more easily seen if we frame the difference in operational terms.

When someone claims a god exists it requires certain steps be taken to bring positive evidence and proof to bear on that claim.

 

On the other hand, When someone claims a god does not exist it requires certain steps be taken to bring positive evidence and proof to bear on that claim.

 

The steps taken in both cases are different (the operational nature of the problem is different).

 

I know some will object to the atheist having any burden to prove god does not exist, but I think if you take the strong atheist position you are volunterring an argument that it is safe to conclude, at least beyond any reasonable doubt, that  no gods exist.

 

- kk

Permalink Reply by Angelo on January 2, 2012 at 3:12pm

It is impossible to prove the negative of something, therefore your question isn't relevant.

I am not asking to prove God does not exist. I am asking to show, he is not needed , to explain our existence. 

Permalink Reply by Wesley on January 6, 2012 at 1:36am

There is an everexistent universimagator...that pops universes into existence from seeming nothing but really from other dimensions.  The Universimigator has its existence in all dimensions.... and has always existed.  It is non-sentient, has no plan.  no one knows its purpose.. but ONE of the things it seems to be responsible for is popping universes into existence.

This is better than many God Proposals and like them you cannot prove that it isn't true. 

Is there a reason to believe STRONGLY in the "Universimigator'?  Nope...though something like it might be possible to exist.

There's much more reason to believe STRONGLY that this specific Universimigator does NOT exist...because there is no evidence whatsoever that it does... outside my imagination.  So even though the universe exists my Universimigator proposal for its existence is weak.

I think MOST likely that we have barely scratched the surface of the mystery of this universe...and that we don't know enough to make ANY kind of definitive proposal about it or its possible origins ..... YET.

Do we go with the ancient Greek Myths about the origins?  What about the Norse or Native American proposals?  What about the Hindu or African Proposals?  What about the Hebrews?   The Babylonians?  The Egyptians?   I think not.

Permalink Reply by Angelo on January 6, 2012 at 5:13am

There is an everexistent universimagator...that pops universes into existence from seeming nothing but really from other dimensions.

How could he probably do it outside of time ? 

Permalink Reply by Wesley on January 7, 2012 at 1:23am

First mistake.. you called it a HE.. the universimigator is non-sentient and exists in all dimensions including those outside of time.

Time is just ONE of the dimensions..  It is 'expressed' when the Universimigator farts a big bang universe into existence from another dimension.

 

Permalink Reply by Angelo on January 7, 2012 at 5:31am

Time is just ONE of the dimensions..  It is 'expressed' when the Universimigator farts a big bang universe into existence from another dimension.

So why should it do so, unless it makes a decision to create a new universe ? and how do you imagine it finely tuned the expansion rate of the Big Bang ?

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