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Permalink Reply by Dave Mann on June 6, 2010 at 6:18pm

1) there is no reason to believe in a creator-god or any other supernatural being;
2) our species, homo sapiens, is are a social animal. Our existence is dependant on interacting with each other;
3) for most of our species existence, there has been no prohibition against killing other people; large numbers of people have been killed by other people and a very large percentage of these have been killed by people who claimed they were killing because their god(s) wanted then to do so. The bible for example, has several examples of the main characters killing people for no other reason then that they were in the wrong place at the wrong time.
4) the commandment "thou shall not kill" originally meant that only the priestly class had the right the sacrifice animals, it was .... I'm working on this now! 617 EST... more sson

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Permalink Reply by Dave Mann on June 6, 2010 at 6:41pm

4) ... i may abandon point 4 ...
5) less than 1 per cent of the U.S. prison population are atheists. But atheists are close to 15 per cent of the population of the country. I dare you to find one single example of a convicted murderer who is an atheist. Even if you find one, almost all the other murders do and have believed. If belief in god prevented murder, then should not there be more atheist-murderers? But in fact at least 99% of murders believe in a god.

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Permalink Reply by Dave Mann on June 6, 2010 at 6:45pm

6) Human being do not kill each other because we are born with a sense of right and wrong. As we grow older we learn to have regard for others welfare and as adults we understand that life is more enjoyable and more rewarding because we respect the human-made concepts of the rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

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Permalink Reply by Dave Mann on June 6, 2010 at 6:50pm

7) We do not need to believe in any supernatural boogieman, like the Christian volcano god, to know that murder is wrong. But it often helps to believe in a god in order to forget that fact.

8) Stalin was an atheist. But it was not atheism that caused the deaths of many millions of people. It was the fact that the Russian people were blinded by their Christian faith to the point where they were unable to think for themselves and see through Stalin's lies.

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Permalink Reply by Dave Mann on June 6, 2010 at 6:51pm

I'd drop point 4 and re-number these points accordingly... is that good enough Natasha?

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Permalink Reply by Natasha Kenny on June 7, 2010 at 12:02pm

I like points 2,3,6 and 8.I'll use them if the person keeps saying that without a god we won't know what is right and wrong.

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Permalink Reply by Reggie on June 6, 2010 at 6:52pm

I would ask them that if God commanded them to murder babies, would they go about happily doing so? If God is the source of our morality and we don't have any morals built in intrinsically, then how can we even be fit to judge God's morals as being good or evil? And if there are morals built in to us, then why do we need to credit God for them when we can also see morality and altruistic behavior in other animals.

If the only thing preventing them from killing, raping, and being a complete douche is their belief in a God, then they are a scary individual, indeed, and I would encourage their belief in a God.

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Permalink Reply by Natasha Kenny on June 7, 2010 at 11:56am

Thanks Reggie,great points,I'm going to use this.Thanks for helping me.

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Permalink Reply by Reggie on June 7, 2010 at 12:51pm

You are quite welcome! Glad I could help!

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Permalink Reply by Dave Mann on June 6, 2010 at 6:53pm

Point 2 and 6 should be put together.

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Permalink Reply by Dave Mann on June 6, 2010 at 6:54pm

Hey Natasha: What Reggie said! :)

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Permalink Reply by Gaytor on June 7, 2010 at 1:54pm

Without God there is no such thing as right and wrong there is only opinion
Stalin how no reason not to murder anyone that oppose him.

I love these. Were Stalin, Mao, and Pol-Pot the only Atheists in all of time? If it was there lack of belief that caused them to be evil, you would agree that it was the belief of religionists that caused them to do evil. Should we do a tally to see who has done more evil, religionists or Atheists?

So murder is absolutely wrong according to God? "Happy be he who dasheth thy little ones against the stones." Psalm 137:9. I present to you an absolute moral dilemma then, is it moral to kill babies. There are hundreds of these types passages in the Bible. God is not love or moral.

How about abortion... absolutely wrong? Numbers 5:11-31 suggests that if a man believes his wife has been unfaithful that she should drink poison and if she has been unfaithful she will lose the baby and the ability to have more. Confident in your moral absolutes still? Let me know. I'll even let you pick the topic of the moral absolute and I'll show you where it's violated in the Bible. I'll even show you where Jesus calls a woman a dog and suggests murder. The man without sin... pffft!

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