Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Tex in the City on January 29, 2011 at 1:56pm

Most people these days think scientology is a complete load of crap, and most non-mormons think the story behind the mormon faith is complete horseshit.  But when told that I think their own belief is nonsense, like the thousands of others that came before and the thousands sure to come after, that is where they draw the line.  Surely THEY would not be foolish enough to stake their entire life on (in the christian sense) a bunch of stories written by anonymous people thousands of years earlier about people that we can't even prove existed historically.

My mom is a very faithful catholic (and raised her kids as such), and in fact I have never declared my atheism to her because it would break her heart, but sometimes for fun I will bring up a story such as the one above that I know she will think is ridiculous, just to see how she reacts.  And predictably, she will say they obviously have mental problems or are snake oil salesmen.  It doesn't occur to her or most christian people that they are so willing to dismiss MODERN DAY people who declare that they have spoken to god (unless they call themselves a pastor or a priest or a pope), but the authors of the bible declaring that they spoke to god via a burning bush or from a cloud or whatever?  No that is not ridiculous -- that's what actually happened.

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Permalink Reply by Student of Knowledge on October 4, 2011 at 12:35am

I, too, had serious doubts about Marshall as the Messenger of this time.  I, too, thought this might be some sort of scam. 

 

The only thing I found when I became a student of Knowledge was how the New Message resonated within me.  

 

 

 

 

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Permalink Reply by Albert Bakker on October 4, 2011 at 2:23am

Yes, well if you put it that way then it must be all true and stuff. Now you can sign me up too.

Oh no wait, knowledge.. how do you know what you know again? Was it really about resonating frequencies?

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Permalink Reply by Student of Knowledge on October 4, 2011 at 12:17pm

Thank you for your response.  Knolwedge (with a capital K) that we speak of here is not a body of information or system of ideas.  It is our deeper intelligence that knows as opposed to our thiking mind that we created since our birth, through the conditioning of the family, society, religion, government, etc.   So there is our deeper intelligence, our thiking mind, and our body.  Our deeper intelligence knows rather than thinks and it is our moral and ethical foundation.  It is the only part of us, that can't become corrupted, influenced by other forces, or altered.  To reclaim Knowledge within yourself, you can become  a student of Knowledge.  It's a journey that requires patience, persistence, and tolerance; but it's been a journey worthwhile taking.  Please let me know if you'd like further information. 

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Permalink Reply by Albert Bakker on October 4, 2011 at 12:27pm

Yeah, patiently point me to the neuronal correlates of that "deeper intelligence" and the biological substrate of this pre-programmed information content. Thanks.

(Edit: used terms too loosely.)

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Permalink Reply by Student of Knowledge on October 4, 2011 at 6:36pm

Albert, thank you for taking further interest in our deeper intelligence. 

 

We cannot really correlate our deeper intelligence with neuronal or biological processes and it is not a pre-programmed information because we are human beings, not computers with pre-programmed information. 

 

Our deeper intelligence is the Holy Spirit within us.  It is like a seed waiting to be discovered and cultivated so that it can sprout and grow into a big tree.  Most people are unaware of it.  How each individual comes to know about it is truly mysterious.  How some people may just disregard it even if they find out about it and how others feel more intrigued to desire to know more about it.....it's a mystery.  Some will take the journey and reclaim it and others won't.   

 

The New Message from God is here at this time because the humanity is facing many issues such as climate change, political and economical instabilities, environmental degradation, loss of arable land and fresh water, catastrophic weather pandemic disease, worldwide conflict, declining energy and natural resources,...., not the least of which is the presence of intelligent life from outer space here to take advantage of the weak and divided humanity to take control of the world.  God knows the  predicament that the humanity is facing.  So God has provided Message to alert and counsel the humanity through the Angelic Presence watching over this world.  The Messenger has been receiving the Message from the Angelic Presence in the past 25 years.  There are over 9000 pages of Teachings revealed to him on more than 800 encounters with the Angelic Presence.  The Message is vast encompassing many aspects about human life, intelligent life in the universe, the mental environment, the Great Waves of Change (issues above), spiritual practices, etc. 

 

The New Message is not based on any previous religious doctrines which do not account for the events occurring in the world and thus, cannot counsel the humanity on how to prepare itself for the present and the future. 

 

Here is one of the Teachings you might find intriguing:

http://newmessage.org/ee/index.php/special-teachings/god-knowledge-...     

 

I would be very interested to find out what you think of it.

 

 

 

 

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Permalink Reply by Albert Bakker on October 5, 2011 at 1:53am

Yes I thought so. Your deeper knowledge first was part of us and accessible  in ourselves by unthinkingly accept Summers' Teachings, but now I ask you to locate it, instead of giving up because you don't know - which would be an acceptable answer - it suddenly morphs into the Holy Spirit and isn't part of us at all. Now we have (yawn, there is that worn out Biblical metaphor again) to plant a seed and truly mysteriously grow a big tree.

And importantly this must be done without thinking, because that is the best way to solve problems like climate change, wars, environmental and energy crises and so on.

If you want to find out what I thought of this "Teaching" I'll tell you. It wasn't intriguing. Far from it. I thought it a tediously long piece of New-Age/ Christian cross-over claptrap that perhaps might distinguish itself from the thirteen a dozen variety by being more infantile as is typical.

You can bring my message over to the "Angelic Presence" that they perhaps might reconsider the packaging if they wish to address a mature audience.

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Permalink Reply by Student of Knowledge on October 5, 2011 at 12:17pm

Hi Albert,

 

Thank you for sharing your perspective with me. 

 

Our deeper Knowledge is the only part of us that has never become separated from God, unlike our body and our surface mind.  Our deeper mind existed before we came into this world and it is the only part of us that will continue on when our body and surface mind perish in this reality.  For you to try to locate Knowledge would be analogous to trying to locate your love for someone.  Can you locate your love? 

 

All religions have originated from intelligent beings’ desire to connect with God, to have relationship with God.  As such, the essence of all religions is fundamentally same.  For example, the New Message from God emphasizes on love, forgiveness, tolerance, patience, devotion, humility, honesty, etc. as does Christianity.  However, I don’t think there is any religion which educates and prepares the humanity about the intelligent life in the universe, contact with intelligent life from outer space, and the Great Waves of Change that are occurring now.  So the New Message from God is not some cross-over of other religions.  It is here to educate and prepare the humanity for the present and for the future. 

 

By the way, the Angelic Presence that speaks through the Messenger is the same Presence that spoke to Moses, Buddha, Jesus, and Muhammad. There has been one Messenger approximately every millennium. 

 

I’m not sure what you mean by “it must be done without thinking.”  If you are referring to meditation by stilling our mind, yes, you do need to still your surface mind in order to access your deeper mind.  Have you ever tried clearing your mind and not thinking about anything just for five minutes?  […waiting while you try…]  If that’s difficult, try observing what you’re thinking for about five minutes.  […waiting while you’re observing…]  Our surface mind is full of useless thoughts growing like weeds clouding up and covering up our deeper mind from expressing.  Our deeper mind counsels us but we cannot “hear” because of all the “noise” that our surface mind makes.  Knowledge is immense.  But if you have ever had some profound insight then that’s a small indication of Knowledge expressing within yourself.  It was your voice thinking but your insight came from your deeper mind.  In order to gain access to our deeper mind, we have to still our surface mind.  This is how we connect with God.

 

You wish God’s Message were packaged to address a mature audience.  I think it already is meant to address individuals with open-mind and a sense of greater purpose for being here.  At any rate, the humanity is an immature race collectively.  It is too arrogant and ignorant as to think God has already given all of God’s Messages and there can be no more Messages from God.  Humanity’s focus is on acquiring more and more of wealth, power, relationships without any true purpose, ideas, etc…  In the process of acquiring, it has squandered its natural inheritance of resources and environment and now, it is facing the consequence of its actions.  Humanity is collectively irresponsible and individually self-serving generally.  It is bellicose.  In order to become a mature race, the humanity needs to become educated about life in the universe and prepare itself for the contact with intelligent life (for premature contact would be devastating for the human race and contact itself will be unavoidable in the future) and for the Great Waves of Change.  If successful, the humanity will emerge as a strong, united, self-sufficient, self-determined, independent race. 

 

If you can open your mind a little bit, perhaps you can see the bigger picture and comprehend the reason that the New Message of God is here at this time. 

 

I hope that answers some of your questions.             

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Permalink Reply by Albert Bakker on October 5, 2011 at 3:35pm

Can you locate your love?

Yes we can locate love in the brain, actually we can go further than that and distinguish different phases of love in the brain, chemically and anatomically.

So love at least didn't exist before we came into this world as it is a function of our brain, a selected for trait.

Perhaps "deeper love" did exist before we came into this world on condition that it stops existing when we came into the world because the rest of it that does exist is locatable in the brain.

By the way if that Angelic Presence (suppose it sounds more impressive than simply angels) instructed Moses, Buddha, Jesus and Muhammed, can't say I admire their work, but seems to me that Angelic Presence organization or whatever needs to first clear up that ugly mess before starting a new franchise don't you think?

What I meant with "without thinking" is exactly what you started out by saying. You said "our deeper intelligence knows rather than thinks" implying that you can't acquire "deeper knowledge" by thinking, as it isn't acquired knowledge at all but pre-existing and you only have access to it by downloading it straight from the source into the brain. Otherwise it could conceivably become "corrupted, influenced by other sources or altered" wouldn't you say?

Now you even make it worse by saying that thinking with your "surface brain" (what the hell is that?) actually makes it harder to receive (hear) that "deeper knowledge," now not localized in the brain but coming from some other source that you identified as being the "Holy Spirit within us."

I'm sure this stuff is meant for people with open minds. Which is a nice way of saying gullible. It must be because none of it makes any sense. In fact it doesn't even mean anything. To be sure it is sugary sounding, this vanilla New Age word-pudding, so I am sure there must be an "open minded" audience for this kind of message, but there won't be any torch bearers of the future among them.

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Permalink Reply by Student of Knowledge on October 5, 2011 at 5:00pm

Hi Alex, thank you for your response. 

 

I think what you refer to as love is actually how our body reacts to love physiologically and neurologically.  That is not quite the same as love itself, is it?  Would you say your love disappears as soon as you die then, since the location of your love, according to you, is in your brain which perishes with your death?  The love of Angelic Presence for us, for example, cannot be located in their brain or body because they don’t exist in this physical reality.  Yet, love exists.    

 

Yes, deeper love (or I’d call it Great Love) existed before we came into our existence in this reality and will continue to exist after we no longer exist in this reality. 

 

Is it possible that what you don’t admire is the religions established based upon their Teachings?  Religions tend to become corrupted over time for various reasons.  The essence of their Teachings becomes tainted and lost in the rituals, rites, politics, and desires for wealth and power, etc.  I completely understand your perspective in this regard because I, too, experienced similar disappointment in religions before.  But to be frank with you, I don’t know whether the “ugly mess” can actually be cleared up. 

 

The New Message from God isn’t really here to replace of all the preexisting religions but rather to expand their Teachings to include what other religions didn’t and couldn’t yet account for, such as presence of extraterrestrial beings in this solar system, whose intention is to conquer the weak and divided humanity for the resources of this planet, contact with intelligent beings in the universe, and the Great Waves of Change that are occurring in the world currently.  These events are occurring now and these great events could potentially undermine the human civilization and/or take the human freedom and self-determination away.  That is the reason that the New Message form God is here to alert the humanity, educate and counsel the humanity to prepare.   

 

Yes, our deeper intelligence knows rather than thinks.  Our deeper intelligence, Knowledge, cannot be acquired and cannot be downloaded (it puts a smile on my face here because the image of downloading files from internet come to my mind when you use this term) and it doesn’t exist in our brain.  Knowledge is vast and it exists within us and without.  It is waiting to be discovered and reclaimed by each one of us, if one is willing to take the journey.  That journey is called the Steps to Knowledge.  It cannot be reclaimed by reading the book for a few hours.  It cannot be reclaimed by taking the journey for a few days, weeks, or even months.  That’s why one must be very patient and perseverant.    

 

The surface mind is the mind that you’re calling your mind; it is the mind that you created since you were born via conditioning of your family, friends, governments, religions, cultures, and any other authorities that influence you.  Your surface mind thinks but what does it actually know?  I would like you to quiet your mind and ask these questions: “What do I really know?  What I learned in school?  What I learned from reading books?  What various authorities tell me?”  If you would, try to ask these questions very slowly one at a time and see what answers surface.

 

I think open-mindedness is an attitude of a person who is willing to hear about what other people have to say without judging them even if what they hear doesn’t conform to their own ideas, cultures, beliefs, or mindset.  I think you’re actually very open-minded if you’re communicating with me about this intellectually.  Regarding the Message, actually, I didn’t find any Teachings of the New Message from God sugary.  In fact, most Teachings, if not all, that I read engender deep thoughts about and deep evaluation of myself and the world, incite understanding, compassion, and gratitude even in those who seem to err against us, and educate me to see what I couldn’t see because I don’t have the vantage point.  None of them are really “sugary sounding or vanilla New Age word-pudding-like.”

 

Thank you for your open-mindedness and for your response.      

 

 

 

 

 

Permalink Reply by Student of Knowledge on October 6, 2011 at 1:59am

I apologize.  I meant Albert, not Alex.

Permalink Reply by Albert Bakker on October 6, 2011 at 4:41am

I think we can clear up right away that we live in a different Universe altogether by stating that there is no such thing as "love itself" divorced from the brain.

When you die, you do not love anymore. In fact there is no you anymore. The only loving in connection with you that does exist resides in the brains of those who do live and knew you. (Or you might hope so, which is another thing your brain does: hoping.)

Also love isn't uniquely human. It manifests itself differently in different (at least mammalian) species because we have different brains, and even so within species differently in different individuals because again we all have are our own unique brain.

The only thing that is evenly distributed among all individuals in total disregard of the individuality of brains is common sense as Descartes noticed.

But Descartes has been wrong more often, as he must not have had access to "deeper knowledge."

Fortunately you do have access to knowledge the rest of the world doesn't apparently if you 'know' and even "account for" extraterrestrial beings in this very solar system. Well that at least is interesting.

Are we talking about micro-organisms on Europa or flying saucer material or invisible beings who live in another dimension or what?

I'm curious though that if you have direct access to deeper knowledge about the Universe to guide us through the Great Waves of Change and prepare us for First Contact (am I breaking any copyright laws now?) could you tell me a minor thing like if we are going to find if a neutrino really can travel faster than c?

It can't be secret knowledge that we aren't to be trusted with yet as we gonna find out in a couple of years anyway. And just in case if that's allowed by the Angelic Presence could you please reveal to me the correct ontological model of gravity?

It might help us with our preparations for the unavoidable future first contacts with that extraterrestrial intelligent life you revealed to us.

The deeper knowledge about religions sucking and that we messed up the environment and cause the climate to go berserk and should forgive, be tolerant, have patience, be devoted, have humility, be honest and all that isn't really all that revelatory and probably won't help us anymore now than it has the past millennia.

Good old fashioned hard working brains, being wrong and correcting mistakes and struggling onward with that scientific method, slowly building up a body of knowledge probably has the better cards when comparing to not think and try to hear your Holy Spirit talk to your surface brain about Angelic Presences and Great Waves of Change.

Excessively using capitals for nonsense terms probably won't matter either.

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