I read posts here that call different things, "harmful to humanity."  Others call something, "good" or "bad" or "evil."

A very simple question, who gets to decide the definition of  "harmful to humanity" and what is there critieria? The same for "good," "bad," and "evil?" These are not material terms. If everything is material isn't there just "is" and not these moral declarations if one is being thoroughly atheist?

Help me understand your position so I am fair and honest about the views. Thanks.

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In a world where obesity soon affects more people than starvation (if not already), it is safe to say that the problem isn't production, but allocation.

Either way, a smaller population would solve many of our problems.

Heather, THIS post is about ethics.  It is you who follow members to any place the word animal or vegan is mentioned. Then you jump in to discourage any compassion.  You act as a troll acts.    

Well, actually it was about where Atheists get their ethics - asked by someone who believes in a god.  I didn't jump in on the vegan issue until you had posted over 2 pages worth of vegan diatribe.  Just because it is about ethics, doesn't mean it needs to be hijacked by your evangelizing.

Your hostility is expected. This study amply demonstrated the overreaction of meat eaters to vegetarians, and the 'knee-jerk' reaction when faced by a minority moral view. It's interesting that slavery abolitionists were called zealots of mistaken compassion in their day.

Thinkers from Mahatma Gandhi to Schopenhauer to Mark Twain have observed that new ideas go through several phases: First they provoke laughter, then anger, and finally they are accepted as common sense.  

And again you resort to appeal to authority - although this time you create a strawman by suggesting a balanced diet is akin to slavery.  You are still avoiding the issue at hand - as an Atheist, what do you consider the basis of your morality?

Reporting on the observations is hardly an appeal to authority. I consider the basis of my morality to be the promtion of well being and the avoiding causing unnecessary harm and suffering.

You haven't explained why people starving is a moral issue for you? Is it because, as you said in another post, they will not feel secure?

I guess you missed my reply.


Then I'll let you dig through all these pages to find it an reply to it directly rather than starting here where you've already misstated my position.

I think it was you who posted the video that showed how educated people could be stupid. Well done for that.

Don't try to trivialise a valid and important argument by dumbing it down. You know, but pretend otherwise, that no one is equating slavery with choosing a balanced diet.

The issue is the ethics of inflicting immense suffering on sentient beings and justifying it on a genetic difference I.e. species. The argument is that discrimination on the basis of species is arbitrary, LIKE (although NOT the same) discriminating on the basis of skin colour.

To represent the argument as you have reflects badly on you and serves only to hide the fact that you have no consistent, intelligible ethical philosophy yet expressed.

You make this wild claim about 'immense suffering' being inflicted on 'sentient beings' as though that is a given.  Unless you are prepared to have a factual discussion then what's the point?

Everything is a slippery slope, false dichotomy, or strawman with you.  I think the only variation I've seen so far was your completely irrelevant links about food-calorie production.



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