I would like to try this again but first can I just let you know that I am an atheist who is trying to understand the religious point of view. This is not the same thing agreeing with them but I truly am trying to see it from their angle. I want to step into their shoes and I want to feel it the way they feel it and in that way, hopefully try to solve problems with them instead of against them. This is empathy. This is peace.
About the name I use - Evangelia is my Mothers name and the English version of that is Angela. It makes me happy to see my mothers name. David is a biblical name to but that doesnt mean people named David are religious.
When you ASSUME you make an ASS out of U and ME
Love The Sinner - Hate the Sin
I think that message runs right through the bible
According to the bible adultery is a mortal sin.
Homosexuality comes under adultery because anyone that you sleep with apart from your spouse is considered adultery.
Marriage is well defined in the bible as being between a MAN and a WOMAN
Therefore homosexuality is a sin ...
Is that better?
So the problem for the devout Catholics I guess is, how do they reconcile that ...
Or how could atheists help them reconcile it? ...
I can see how this is a real sticky issue for them because changing it means thay have to admit that God was wrong.
How do they do that?
How did they get around slavery? How did they get around the earth rotation around the sun? They will find a way, because they will have to find a way.
But Strega - see .. I dont use that angle with them anymore,
It doesnt work - It just doesnt.
I can put shit on them just like the rest and I have ... believe me I have and I still cant resist a good jab.
but I am trying to be mellower about it now.
I want to try something different.. Out of the (sand) box
and all of those points you make are still valid but - - oh i dunno - just but.
something about forrests and tree's.
Strega - I reckon they were able to get around those things because those things arent mortal sins...
The mortal sin thing is a biggie for them.
How does one determine what a mortal sin is, as opposed to a non-mortal one? I would have thought the ten commandments were 'mortal sins' just because so much fuss surrounded their production. But if anything, the bible's references to homosexuality are by deduction, rather than by direct instruction. What qualifies a sin as the 'mortal' variety?
Good Question Strega ...
I would like to know that myself.
Im off to find out.
Ok there are Mortal Sins (the biggies) and the Venial Sins (the littlies)
it would be great to have someone explain it properly because the more we understand it the better and richer the dialogue - maybe.
I think before you go that far to finding what is mortal and non mortal sins, what is sin? I think that is the starting point.
That is such a good question.
I think that sin is the ancient philosophical way of saying that, at mans very worst, at the very core of his being, all of us, depending on our environment are capable of commiting horrendouse act of cruelty upon each other and that those acts of cruelty can be so extreme that the God who was invented had to be more extreme than that.
What do you think it is?
I'm on the road this weekend and so away from where I can look up more accurate and poetic language.
Sin is a word to define choices which harm our relationships with each other and with God, and thereby cause harm to ourselves and the world. In the particular it can be actions, like theft; in the abstract it is perhaps better defined as ways of thinking and choosing, like Envy, that lead to the theft.
The difference between a mortal sin and a "venial" sin roughly corresponds to the difference in civil law between a felony and a misdemeanor. Some of it has to do with the level of seriousness of the act, and some of it has to do with the mental state of the person (like level of intent).
Within Catholicism, mortal sin has to involve a grave matter (like murder), and requires both knowledge that it's wrong and deliberate intent to do wrong.