The only proof that the old Testament offers for the immutability of the counsel of God, are the blessings to your health and prosperity if you serve him without hypocrisy.
Has anyone tried this test for the existence of God?
‘Why have we fasted,’ they say,
‘and you have not seen it?
Why have we humbled ourselves,
and you have not noticed?’
“Yet on the day of your fasting, you do as you please
and exploit all your workers.
4Your fasting ends in quarreling and strife,
and in striking each other with wicked fists.
You cannot fast as you do today
and expect your voice to be heard on high.
5Is this the kind of fast I have chosen,
only a day for a man to humble himself?
Is it only for bowing one’s head like a reed
and for lying on sackcloth and ashes?
Is that what you call a fast,
a day acceptable to the Lord?
6“Is not this the kind of fasting I have chosen:
to loose the chains of injustice
and untie the cords of the yoke,
to set the oppressed free
and break every yoke?
7Is it not to share your food with the hungry
and to provide the poor wanderer with shelter—
when you see the naked, to clothe him,
and not to turn away from your own flesh and blood?
8Then your light will break forth like the dawn,
and your healing will quickly appear;
then your righteousnessa will go before you,
and the glory of the Lord will be your rear guard.
9Then you will call, and the Lord will answer;
you will cry for help, and he will say: Here am I.
“If you do away with the yoke of oppression,
with the pointing finger and malicious talk,
10and if you spend yourselves in behalf of the hungry
and satisfy the needs of the oppressed,
then your light will rise in the darkness,
and your night will become like the noonday.
If it is mumbo-jumbo then what would be the benefit to one writing it? And wouldn't people immediately falsify what is being stated then have the prophet stoned for lying. This was the consequence of false prophecies, death!
It doesn't sound like prophecy to me, it sounds like standard sermon mumbo jumbo. All it's assertions are extremely vague, how would someone falsify it? Particularly when it was presented to a bunch of illiterate goatherds not exactly versed in the scientific method.
God appears as a fire to consume the Holocaust offering and also gave them direction in battle. Of what use is the scientific method in these instances.
Are you implying that the Levites were not level and above board and the fame of King David and Solomon did not exist and all their exploits and battles.
Why should I believe you?, There is archeological confirmation that confirms the reigns of these men. You next interjection will be yes, but the story about them are purely myth and lore. Well that is what the supernatural will always sound like, myth and lore and myth and lore is being generated as we speak. See that attached clip on this thread.
I really am fed up with all you religious [edited by moderator.- Nelson] who joins this site to keep insisting repeatedly that your particular scripture has meaning and that it is the truth and answer to everything. All you do is cherry pick whatever you want and interpret it in whatever way you want for whatever purpose you want!
On behalf of atheists who find scripture to have historical value but otherwise find it utterly uninteresting I would like to say to you and your fellow scripture preachers:
[edited by moderator.- Nelson]
Michael: prophecy is nearly always couched in terms that cannot be falsified. Obviously. And it's pretty darned clear that some of the NT writers were desparate to demonstrate JC to be fulfilling certain OT prophecies. On those few occasions when prophecy is not so termed - and has actual dates and specifics, (ie it is falsifiable) it always turns out to be BS. I'd point to the recent end times insanity in the US here.
The benefit to the writer is that he gains credibility and power (and potentially cash thereby) from the poor saps he persuades to believe it: again well demonstrated thoughout history. You don't ever have to be right - just credible and persuasive.
False prophets aren't killed because their prophecies are false (they all are, after all) but because politically someone with more power didn't like the message.
Here's a question for you: how do you decide what is true and what is not true? What's your method?
I use history, the Cambridge Ancient History Volumes in my research and also volumes on the Papacy, Medieval history, the changing maps of Europe and current events in my research of the last 2000 years of fulfiled prophecies. Once again there is a nutshell on my blog.
Use what you like Michael: you suffer from confirmation bias like the rest of us. I grew up in a house full of prophecy fulfillment freakery and I recognise it quickly every time I see it.
How do you know you are right and not others? You rely on your study? But very clever people disagree with you: aren't you worried that you might be wrong? (This was a killer argument for me personally: much cleverer people than me all disagreed, so relying on my intellect to work out which of the competing non-evidence based claims was right was always going to be virtually impossible if approached with integrity).
So aren't you worried that actually it might really matter which god you devote yourswelf to, and what his/her characterristics are like, whether he/she wants sacrifices or not, wants priests dressed in pruple robes (I'm sure you'll like that if you have a of symbollism) etc. If you rely on your head, and the selected thinking of others, how do you know you are right?
And what is the mechanism for people knowing what will happen in the future, given your fondness for prophecy? How does that actually work? Is there a mystical being knows what will happen? If so doesn't that cause some problems in terms of whether such a being could possibly be described as good?
Explain how can you serve god without "hypocrisy" according to your believes? If you are claiming that those who serve him without "hypocrisy" will get something out of it (health and prosperity), then Im sorry to burst your bubble, but you are doing it expecting something back, you are doing it to ultimately be rewarded, not because you even "LOVE" your god.
Your servitude to god has a price, the price is that he MUST pay your selfcentered efforts to please him. Who do you think you are that a narcissistic god , as described in the bible, need to reward you for doing what he created you to do, you were created to PRAISE him.
If you are going to believe in the bible at least believe in the whole concept, not in cherry picked sections that only seduce greedy individuals.
Read the excerpt, God is doing all the promising. God is speaking in the first person through the prophet.
I don't care what your god told someone thousands of years ago, if he wants me to do something then he should tell it to me himself, isnt him omnipotent?
No. I don't believe that god exists. BTW it is not "proof" that the O.T. offers.