Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Alice Browne on June 5, 2012 at 10:29am

If you are going to call yourself spiritual, then it is up to you to define what "spiritual" means, not us.

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Permalink Reply by Jaret on June 5, 2012 at 10:50am

I think what you are looking for is pantheist or deist. I usually consider myself a pantheist. I believe a lot of scientist actually have pantheistic ideas such as hawking and einstein which is why they talk about God. Atheist is actually anti-theist. Which means against god. So technically an atheist is simply someone who does not believe in a god. You can therefore be a spiritual atheist if you do not believe in a god but in spirituality. However, spirituality would infer a higher power even if that power is ourselves which would make us deities in a sense and thusly gods. I therefore believe spiritual atheism is actually pantheism. 

When a christian asks me what I am, I say an atheist. When an atheist, or more educated person ask me, I say pantheist. Otherwise christians may think I believe in a God in the traditional sense and think I am a christian which is not the case. They have done this with both Albert Einstein as well as Steven Hawking claiming they are christians for mentioning a pantheistic god. 

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Permalink Reply by Forrest Schaeffer on June 5, 2012 at 11:13am

I'm not sure I agree that atheist = anti-theist. One of those makes a claim (anti-theist "there is no god") whereas the other simply rejects the claims of others (atheist "I don't believe in any of your gods"). 

But maybe I'm wrong on my definitions. 

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Permalink Reply by Heather Spoonheim on June 5, 2012 at 11:26am

I believe you are correct, Forrest.  Further, I would say that in the most pure sense, "Atheist" is simply that absence of theistic belief - there doesn't even need to be a pro-active rejection.

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Permalink Reply by Forrest Schaeffer on June 5, 2012 at 11:32am

Ah, yes. I agree with you. The confusion comes from the fact that we have created a name for it. I think Sam Harris has a bit about how we don't have a-astrologists or other descriptions for people who lack a certain attribute. Generally we don't describe things by what they aren't. 

Thanks for the note!

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Permalink Reply by Heather Spoonheim on June 5, 2012 at 11:38am

Well, we do have apolitical, amoral, and asexual.  These are things that are more of an 'outlook' or 'perspective' than simple body of knowledge.  I suppose I could try to persuade someone to a position of 'agravity' but that wouldn't cause them to float away.

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Permalink Reply by Forrest Schaeffer on June 5, 2012 at 11:39am

Ha. That makes me think of Tim Minchin and his skit on gravity. 

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Permalink Reply by matt.clerke on June 6, 2012 at 3:37am

I'm curious as to how you can say that spirituality infers a higher power?

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Permalink Reply by Heather Spoonheim on June 5, 2012 at 10:50am

You know, technically a deist might be considered an Atheist, since theism involves not just a belief in a god, but some rituals and doctrines combined to form a 'religion' or theology.  So, in that sense, one might be an Atheist yet hold to the notion of mind/brain duality even though there is no evidence for it (and plenty of evidence against it).  I'm sure many Atheists would disagree.

There are no prerequisites in Atheism for rationality, logic, evidentiary epistemology, or skepticism.  One could be Atheist yet believe the Great Gazoo acts as their extra-terrestrial guardian angel.  I've even run across Atheists who believe in holistic medicine.  Bleh.

As for myself, I've become more of an anti-supernaturalist than Atheist.  Of course I'm still an Atheist because I am without theological ritual/doctrine or god-belief, but for me that is just a byproduct of anti-supernaturalism.

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Permalink Reply by Michael Appleman on June 5, 2012 at 5:49pm

Thats how I am too. My atheism came from a more general rejection of the supernatural.

I can certainly see how someone might believe in more general supernatural ideas, and still reject the idea of gods. To me though, the distinction between a supernatural intelligence and anything else supernatural is pretty much non existent. If you think there is supernatural 'stuff', what makes you think that there are not also supernatural 'beings'?

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Permalink Reply by Heather Spoonheim on June 5, 2012 at 5:56pm

Exactly. :D

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Permalink Reply by matt.clerke on June 6, 2012 at 3:42am

I wouldn't consider a deist to be an atheist. I suspect our definitions may be different... but that would make us adeist atheists.

Yeah OK, deists are technically atheists in that they are non-theists.

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