If you are a non- believer, why be moral when no one is looking?

If you are a non- believer in, all that you do is being recorded in the heavens, why be moral when no one is looking?

If there are no records and no witness, why not do anything you want?


If no one sees you do it, then is it a deed not done?


If all of this is true, then why do we have a conscience, where did it come.


We are told in scriptures that our conscience is our natural way of doing God's will in the absence of his Law.

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   Morals and morality are a social structure that is drilled in us from such a young age, that we start to think it is instinct. Nature has no conscience. Nature consoles itself by knowing that it did what it did because it had to. Humans were once the same way, but we decided to form groups, which means we formed a culture, which meant we needed rules for how to conduct ourselves in that culture. Every pack based animal does this, dogs, wolves, cows, horses, everything. They all create rules for how to act within the group.

   You've been taught from such a young age that killing is wrong, but it isn't wrong if your being strangled by someone, and you kill in self defense. Well, its not wrong in most states of the union. That act that you think is vile and immoral, is justified by the fact that it was done in the name of self preservation.

   So, be happy to know that the entire system you base your principles on, is made up. Morals do not exist, we create an illusion of morals, so we can all get along. Take the group aspect of human existence away, and you take morals with it.

   Oh, and you were an atheist at seven? I'm surprised you could spell the word atheist at seven, let alone tell what it meant. The fire thing, I can explain that. You weren't being evil, you weren't being wicked, you weren't being immoral. You were being, and hang on, cuz this can blow your mind... a seven year old kid. Welcome to our universe, where kids aren't angels, and they don't always tell the truth, especially when it gets them in trouble.

You kind find plenty of examples of ethical and altruistic behavior in social animals. Even rules of conduct with transgressions having defined responses. It's particularly evident in very intelligent ones like apes, but can also be witnessed in other species. Whether ones calls that conscience, morality or something else is a matter of debate, but many social animals do care about each other - at least within their own group. Not much different from humans really.

Well, my, my. What dark, deep secrets and desires do you have that you need to believe that someone is watching you taking notes, on your every thought, word and deed, to keep you on the straight and narrow. Mmmmm. 


Is the only thing stopping you from rape and torture, is that you think god is watching you. How very sad, and bloody scary. Please don't become an atheist if you need a nasty vindictive jealous power hungry, misogynist to keep you on the straight and narrow. But whose straight and narrow are we talking about - this moron in a primitive book. You keep your book and your god.


I have my morals and ethics - certainly nothing to do with your god. He is jealous, murderous, vicious and loves torture. I don't murder, rape, am vicious or vengeful, which is the norm with your god. And, do you know what, it isn't even a stretch for me not to be any of these things. Atheists are moral for their own sake, for their families sake, for societies sake. Very simple. It makes us happy. No guilt - it is a really nice place to be.


And even when all these religious people might believe that someone is watching, and taking notes, they STILL do crimes against humanity - as in rampant pedophilia. I have very big doubts that these particular people just don't believe, they just want to keep themselves in the manner in which they become accustomed. 


Your god and you are just nowhere near good enough for us.


The operative is still a conscience, which has been euphemized  in many ways on many posts on this thread. The question is still begged, where did it come from given that the driver of evolution is survival of the fittest. And since we share 97 percent of our DNA with primates and our common ancestor, allegedly is not that far back in the paleontological record. What is the mechanism to lay down such complex circuitry in the frontal lobes over such a small expands of time. Having 97 percent of our DNA already established.

The question is still begged, where did it come from

That is not the question you asked.

You lectured us on some silly superstition

all that you do is being recorded in the heavens

And then without having had the decency to check whether perhaps this is a genuinely old canard, asked a question that we have all engaged with a million times, with protected little souls like yourself:

why be moral when no one is looking?

You then demonstrated repeatedly that you don't want to know what we think: rather you wanted to fight with some atheists, presumably to show how clever you are or something?

And then you lectured us with some more utter BS nonsense:

We are told in scriptures that our conscience is our natural way of doing God's will in the absence of his Law.

Why are you here Michael?  Please tell us.

The fact that you have to ask this question proves that you are only moral because god told you to be.

We strive to be morally correct because it's the right thing to do. It does not cause harm to others and is potentially the most productive thing one can do for their society.

You should feel ashamed for needing an imaginary friend telling you to be good in order for you to be good.

Read the beginning of the post again and you will disprove your assumption.

The beginning of the post contains the utterly ludicrous (and inflamatory) statement:  

all that you do is being recorded in the heavens

Why would we need to read more, Michael?  Do you think your arguments are new to us?

Let me reiterate then with new words. The law of the land and human conscienceness suffices as a sufficient emulation of God to maintain social order. Thus we have God vacuum, so where does this vacuum come from. There, I can't say it more direct then that.

suffices as a sufficient emulation of God

Why can't you see how ridiculous this is, when you've been on this board as much as you have been? You know that we will ask you 'which god', etc - you know that your god makes us laugh/vomit/scream. So why posit his/her existence is these terms? We obviously cannot engage with a statement as problematic as that.

The fact that you can't express yourself really does remain your problem Michael.  And the fact that you dishonestly attempt to engage in this debate, without the slightest interest in sincerity or integrity, means that you are going to get exposed - as many have done on this thread.

Again: why are you here?

Your statements appear to be perpendicular to this thread. I don't see the correlation. Better for you to quote a point I made  and give a rebuttal.

All you do is make grand stand grumpy statements not addressing the points I put forward.  Where you ever on a debating team?

Everyone else can, why do you have deficiency?

Actually, you don't raise any relevant points. All you do is repeat often nonsensical statements (like your fixation on survival of the fittest, even though you don't have any idea what that phrase means)


You're also a hypocrite. You accuse people of not answering your arguments. At the same time you constantly refuse to do the same.


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