I need debate help... Does good come from God?
We have now come to the part of this debate where I asked, " Is what we consider morally good that way because God commands that which is morally good, or is whatever God commands morally good because he commands it?
His comment is as follows: If "good" is determined by people, then people are greater than God. If "good" exists outside of God, then "good" is greater than God. In neither of those cases can God really be God. "Good" is what God says is "good."
Any recommendation on how to respectfully shut that down in one brief answer?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by archaeopteryx on -
RE: "you can't escape a discussion of The Good with that dodge"
"dodge," Unseen? Really??
You make it sound as though I have an obligation to explain myself, which is certainly not the case. Why I choose to avoid doing harm is, in all likelihood different from why you might make the same choice, if in fact you would. Unless I'm mistaken (and with all of those philosophy classes on your transcript, I would expect you to know), that's one of the definitions of the word, "subjective."
pax vobiscum,
archaeopteryx
www.in-His-own-image.com
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Permalink Reply by Unseen on -
If ethics is all relative to one's subjectivity (one's wants, desires, and inclinations), then of course there's no need to explain yourself because there's no WAY to explain yourself. However, by that standard (or more precisely by the lack thereof) the behavior of the man sexually abusing the child is no better or worse than the one saving the child from drowning. Each has his own subjective standard of behavior according to which whatever we do is right because it's what we are inclined to do.
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Permalink Reply by archaeopteryx on
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RE: "the behavior of the man sexually abusing the child is no better or worse than the one saving the child from drowning"
In their minds, or mine?
pax vobiscum,
archaeopteryx
www.in-His-own-image.com
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Permalink Reply by Unseen on
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All of us live in two spheres: our own consciousness and in an outside world shared with others. We need some way to determine what is good because, as I pointed out with the child abuse example, if we don't then whatever someone does is ipso facto ethically correct simply because it's what they wanted to do.
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Permalink Reply by archaeopteryx on
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RE: "whatever someone does is ipso facto ethically correct simply because it's what they wanted to do."
Which brings us back to the question I asked earlier that appears to have gone unanswered. in who's mind? Mine or theirs?
And you mentioned, "ethically correct" - do you see no difference between ethics and morals? If so, please elaborate.
pax vobiscum,
archaeopteryx
www.in-His-own-image.com -
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Permalink Reply by Logicallunatic on -
"Good" is what God says is "good."
This justifies everything from the genocide of the Amalekites, the crusades, and the inquisition and so on. God's 'goodness' is nothing but sanctimonious certainty.
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Permalink Reply by Unseen on
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And yet, if God does exist, HE is the decider of what is good and what is not.
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Permalink Reply by Donald S. Chase on -
Bill Clinton instituted "mandatory volunteering" and we all know how "good" he was.
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Permalink Reply by Dale Headley on
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How's this for "one brief answer"? People ARE greater than God.
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Permalink Reply by Violet Chartreuse on -
Good answers. Posted.
The response to the fact that God condones slavery, genocide and rape is......
"God not only defines good, but he executes his wrath."
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Permalink Reply by Nelson on -
But that's no answer at all for if good is only good insofar as god says it is then his wrath at anyone's having failed to be good is arbitrary and capricious too.
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Permalink Reply by Unseen on
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True, but that is your prerogative if you are God, right? If you are God, you exist in a moral vacuum. If God exists, it is not man's place to judge Him.
For example...
If you make a sand painting and dislike it and lay it waste, as its creator that is your prerogative. Were God to exist, and if everything that exists were to be His creation, it is his to do with as he wishes. We would exist at His pleasure.
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