An army is a blunt weapon. Send it into a populated area where the enemy doesn't wear a uniform and innocents are going to die. This is happening right now in Gaza. Many people are quick to blame Israel for these deaths, calling them "unnecessary" or even "war crimes."

Lately, Israel has had to endure unguided missiles raining down on its territory. Since they are unguided, the people launching them, Hamas soldiers, aren't conducting surgical strikes. In fact, it appears they  would be happy if they hit schools, hospitals, markets, and other heavily-populated targets.

So, imagine you are Israel. Do you have another way of attempting to put a stop to the daily barrage of missiles?

This is not an invitation to criticize the creation of Israel after WW2. It's not an invitation to criticize policies you think led up to Hamas.

I'm only asking what's the alternative to sending in its troops to attempt to cleanse Hamas out of Gaza?

Tags: Gaza, Hamas, Israel

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"So far, when a cease fire or other peace effort is made, it seems to be the Israelis who give it a chance."

I know right. Israel is offering them such a generous deal that I have no clue why they would rather die than accept it. After all all they need to do is accept being treated as second class citizens by a military invader and Israel will promise to stop using their state of the art military on them. And if we are to believe Pat Condell the Palestinians are not like us , sub human almost, and therefor Israel is justified in treating them however they please. Just be glad it is not happening to one of us "civilized" ( white) folks.

Noam Chomsky’s statement on Israel’s aggression in Gaza:

“The incursion and bombardment of Gaza is not about destroying Hamas. It is not about stopping rocket fire into Israel, it is not about achieving peace.

The Israeli decision to rain death and destruction on Gaza, to use lethal weapons of the modern battlefield on a largely defenseless civilian population, is the final phase in a decades-long campaign to ethnically-cleanse Palestinians.

Israel uses sophisticated attack jets and naval vessels to bomb densely-crowded refugee camps, schools, apartment blocks, mosques, and slums to attack a population that has no air force, no air defense, no navy, no heavy weapons, no artillery units, no mechanized armor, no command in control, no army… and calls it a war. It is not a war, it is murder.

When Israelis in the occupied territories now claim that they have to defend themselves, they are defending themselves in the sense that any military occupier has to defend itself against the population they are crushing. You can’t defend yourself when you’re militarily occupying someone else’s land. That’s not defense. Call it what you like, it’s not defense.”

If that's the case, the Israelis truly suck at ethnic cleansing, especially considering that they could reduce the area to rubble with few survivors in hours with regular munitions, or to a radioactive wasteland in milliseconds with nuclear weapons. 

A more interesting question is what Hamas hopes to achieve by sending rockets towards Israel when they are well acquainted with the consequences of that particular tactic. 

They can't nuke Gaza without turning their own country into a radioactive wasteland; too close.  The reason they don't reduce the area to rubble with conventional weapons is that there are too many journalists and video cameras watching.  They would be seen as maniacs and outcast by most of the world; though they could still probably trade with China, Russia, and North Korea, and of course the U.S. - because of the whole bible thing.  But Israel continues to push the envelope of what they can get away with.

Hamas hopes to continue goading Israel into taking actions that damage its image on the world stage and that drive young uneducated muslims toward extremism.

And around we go.

Well, the statement was that Israel wanted to ethnically cleanse Gaza, and if they did, they could. Additionally, that they take to account their standing in the world and attempt to minimize civilian casualties does not exactly speak to that statement, does it?

Hamas obviously wants dead Palestinians for propaganda purposes, otherwise what's the point of sending rockets, not building shelters, and import munitions instead of medicines? And Israel promptly obliges.

Yes, around and around we go. 

If their goal were to minimize civilian casualties they would get better intelligence and send in surgical strike special forces teams who are trained for urban fighting.  They would not bombard an entire city block because they think a rocket came from there.  Also, can they not develop better missile defense?  The Hamas missiles are kind of primitive, as in not even guided, aren't they?

Israel thinks they can use force to break the will of Hamas et al.  Their goal is to be as brutal as they can get away with and to do as much ethnic cleansing as they can get away with.

Intelligence is always limited, even for God Mossad. As for specialist teams they can't easily make entry and egress into hostile territory without consent and have a high probability of capture, so it's a moot point. As for missile defence systems, they do have iron dome which is the most advanced in the world. However, missile defence is notoriously unreliable, also see PATRIOT and GMD, and can easily be overwhelmed.  

You have yet to substantiate the claim that "[Israel's] goal is to be as brutal as they can get away with and to do as much ethnic cleansing as they can get away with." 

Yes, I'm sure you're right.  Surgical strikes by specialist teams would not be easy, so screw it.  Let's just bomb the crap out of 'em, hospitals and all.

As far as substantiating the claim, I think the numbers (as of 7/21/14) speak for themselves:

Israel:  29 dead, 2 of which were civilian.

Gaza:  576 dead, ~70% of which were civilian.

I said at the start that an army is a blunt instrument. 

Perhaps Israel should just send hundreds of unguided missiles into Gaza daily. 

But you're so pro-Palestinian you'd probably think that this sort of parity would be unfair for some reason.

At least, before it strikes, Israel leaflets to tell the people to clar out. Why don't they leave? Hamas won't let them. Hamas WANTS the casualties which they can use for their nefarious PR purposes.


So I have my head up my ass and I'm pro-Palestinian now?  I'm kinda used to your tantrums on here, but do you think you could try to discuss a topic without resorting to personal attack or without trying to tell me what I think?

What they are doing now is considered surgical strikes by an advanced military power. Unsurgical strikes would be to park a few dozen MLRS' far inside Israel and let it rip. I think you have watched too many action movies.

A few decades ago  your  statement could have read "The French resistance wants dead Frenchman for propaganda purposes, otherwise what's the point of sending rockets, not building shelters, and import munitions instead of medicines? And Germany  promptly obliges."

You also do realize that what you are saying is that the Palestinians need to just accept being treated as second class citizens by  a foreign invader who's only claim on the Palestinian lands is because some  god promised it to them?

"Well, the statement was that Israel wanted to ethnically cleanse Gaza, and if they did, they could. Additionally, that they take to account their standing in the world"

When has Israel giving much of a damn about foreign opinion? Oftentimes they seem to be breaking international laws every other week. Usually in regard to how they treat the Palestinians. The veto power of the US is the only reason Israel has not faced the UN for a multitude of human rights violations.Hell they even used chemical weapons against civilian area's  in the 2008-2009 Gaza war. All while there is barely a peep from our media. Luckily for the Palestinians outright genocide by Israel would be a risk to  it's American funding and backing. 



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