ground zero
http://rationalists.wordpress.com/2010/07/20/islamic-cultural-centr...
This is the final straw. How many died at Ground Zero. I cannot imagine how I would feel knowing that people will be praying at the very site to a god who through their belief of him had a part in this evil event,..if I had lost a loved one.
Is this the beginning of the end.
What do you think?
This is the final straw. How many died at Ground Zero. I cannot imagine how I would feel knowing that people will be praying at the very site to a god who through their belief of him had a part in this evil event,..if I had lost a loved one.
Is this the beginning of the end.
What do you think?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Nate on -
The only reason I point out that it's not a mosque at Ground Zero isn't because I think it makes a difference, but because it's too often phrased that way to incite fear amongst people that THINK it makes a difference. "Mosque" and "Ground Zero" are terms that evoke emotion from less educated people, so people (like those at Fox News) use them rally up their minions to "take a stand against this injustice." I don't point it out because I think it makes a difference, just trying to prevent people from using this term as if it makes a difference.
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Permalink Reply by Nate on
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I think that 1.5 billion people are being unfairly characterized based on the actions of a few dozen. I don't agree with the tenants of Islam, but this isn't an issue about religion, it's an issue about the Constitution. We have to understand and respect that the same right that allows us to be atheists is the same right afforded to everybody to believe as they choose. As an atheist, if it were up to me there would be no mosques or churches anywhere; as an American I accept that being tolerant of others is part of the responsibility of enjoying the luxury of these freedoms.
The people building the "mosque" (it's not even a mosque) at "Ground Zero" (it's not even at Ground Zero) aren't part of Al Qaida, they are Americans just like you and I. If we start stripping Americans of their rights out of fear, then the terrorists' mission will be accomplished. It's up to us to rise above the fear and paranoia that is in our human nature and do what's right. If we want to stick it to the terrorists who want us to live in fear, we should stop being afraid. We should embrace the Muslim sect into American culture, give them a reason to WANT to call America home. That will be the most effective way to prevent moderate Muslims from sympathizing with the extremists and combatting extremism; if we persecute them we are only causing more division, more friction between the two ways of life, and adding fuel to an already out of control fire.
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Permalink Reply by Bluradio on -
Just want to say that this whole debate has been tainted by misinformation so it shouldn't be a debate in the first place.
Its not a "mosque" its a community center with activities for children and educational programs. The "mosque" is simply an inter-faith prayer room. All this is is to stoke Islamaphobia in this country which is beneficial for right wing conservatives who use scare tactics for votes. I ask everyone, If it was a baptist church who wanted to build a church next to a bombed abortion clinic, would there be the same controversy. This is a joke, both sides ranting about which imaginary friend is better. As an atheist i have no problem with hard working-kind and helpful Americans, whether religious or not. Lets just call it this debate what it is and that's equating all Muslims and Islam with terrorism. Religion isn't the SOLE cause for terrorism, there's a lot of different aspects at play (economics, political instability, brain-washing propaganda etc..) Atheists should use this opportunity to say that without any religion there wouldn't be this division, does the crusades ring a bell?
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Permalink Reply by elaine kilshaw on -
I see we are not coming to any agreement. We all think we are right and those with opposing views are wrong.
Lets wait and see.
I understand the Church will now burn the Koran, so on and on we go.
This is just the way of the World and until we all agree to live along side each other in peace however much we discuss this nothing will change. .
No-one is trying to say religion is wrong it is those who practice for evil, and religion is an excuse, and again this is always how it will be.
Peace to all..
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Permalink Reply by Bill on -
I agree with this! And I don't believe Sam Harris is completely off base for insisting that we regard Islam with special concern. But that shouldn't mean any other religion gets a pass, either.
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Permalink Reply by elaine kilshaw on
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Michel and Bill you put it better than me, and totally agree with everything you say. Religion is wrong.
I dont really think I made myself clear . I do not want to have arguments with those of religion as I think it is a waste of time. . I believe religion is the worse attrossity causer and excuse for evil, and that those who believe in it have been indocrinated. ,and whatever any of us say their minds will not be changed.
Hope that is clearer.
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Permalink Reply by Yet Another Atheist on -
Cracked.com introduced me (and many others) to the 5-Second Clips (or whatever they're called). Where can I find all of them? What's their web site?
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Permalink Reply by Yet Another Atheist on
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Thank you! And the good thing about becoming addicted to something that lasts 5 seconds is that I have plenty of time to indulge in it. :)
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Permalink Reply by Reggie on -
Thunderf00t, who I have always seen as a bastion of reason and light on Youtube, takes a surprising stance on this. Well, surprising to me, at least.
The crux of his argument is that since "they" do it (be intolerant), "we" should to? Wow. I would expect a better argument than that from him.
Not only that, he is pointing to the religion as practiced in other countries. That seems about as relevant as making direct comparisons between Christians in Michigan and Christians in Nigeria. No one goes around haranguing American Christians because of atrocities performed by Nigerian Christians.
Now, to be fair, Tf00t is not saying that they should not have freedoms. He is merely repeating the same mantra from other freedom loving people who want to limit freedoms of others. "They have every right to build it, but..." Sorry, Tf00t. Rights are not conditional. And if his whole point is that they will be seen as jerks because of it and that is all he is saying, then why the hell make a video? Uppity blacks were seen as jerks, too, when they marched for equal rights. Freedom and the ability to practice freedoms is not about popularity. Rights are not conditional or subject to limitations because of popular opinions. And if Christian churches were treated to the same scrutiny anywhere where Christians performed atrocities, then maybe it wouldn't reek of xenophobia as much as it does.
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