I have some pretty strong feelings about eugenics (it's a good and necessary practice), but I find it very, VERY difficult to talk about it with anyone since I'm instantly labeled a Nazi for supporting it. I'm hoping the folks on Think Atheist will be more inclined to intellectual discussion than name-calling and dismissal.
The start off, some disclaimers: genocide is wrong; taking human rights away from people of a race/religion/hairstyle you don't like is wrong; concentration camps are wrong; violence in wrong.
There. Now to the actual discussion.
When I talk about eugenics, I'm talking about the practice of systematically removing debilitating genetic traits and defects from a population by means of regulating the reproduction of its citizens. Do you have Schizophrenia? Did you know that this ailment is genetic and very easy to pass on to you children? Please, do not punish an innocent child with this problem. Are you genetically healthy, intelligent, and talented? Do you have special immunities that make you less likely to get sick? By all means, spread these traits to future generations, either by having children yourself or donating to a sperm or egg bank. Do you want children but should not carry your genetic problems onto them? Adopt. Adoption will always be available no matter what the society (just because someone has good genetic material does NOT mean they would make a good parent). Do you say that adoption is not the same? Then I suppose you care more about satisfying your selfish desires than the well being of a child.
Eugenics is, at its base, very simple - think about the future first.
I'm leaving this post now for what I'm hoping will be thoughtful and anti-inflammatory discussion.
"A pot smoking gamer with a master's in economics is not an economist"
Then presumably I am not an economist by your standards because I like the interesting effects of THC on an impressionable mind, sometimes even checking these effects out while kicking some serious ass in social modeling games.
Also, I don't have a MSc Econ, I have a BSc Econ/Business and an unfinished MSc in Corp. Finance. My actual master's is an MBA. If you first are gonna make fun of credentials, you may want to get it right. :)
I'm not a practicing economist by any standard, but I am "licensed" to call myself one by virtue of a few years of having my thoughts scrutinized by people vastly more knowledgable than I. Those people allowed me to call myself one, and believe it or not, some people's opinion about what I can rightfully call myself count more than yours (!)
Any other words of wisdom regarding me you wish to share, or is ad hom getting tiring?
Because government health care has massive positive externalities (non-direct financial benefits), and also reduces total healthcare expenditure as %age of GDP substantially.
Can you guarantee life without suffering? How can you measure the amount of suffering anyone with encounter because of a disorder? If suffering is the consideration...what about the statistics on suffering once a child is born. Is it child abuse not to keep an eye on my 12 year old because something terrible could happen to here and cause suffering? How do you or anyone else acquire the expertise and objectivity to decide what constitutes disease, objectionable disease, or other situations that lead to suffering?
We need to stop policing the people and start really educating them (without corporate dollars). More "suffering" could be prevented by teaching people to actually take care of themselves and to think for themselves.
Genetic engineering? Fine.
Regulating reproduction? No.
The problem with Eugenics is that we don't know enough about our genetic structure to avoid what happens to pedigree dogs (to the best of my knowledge).
Also, discussion of schizophrenia: Fuck you. Aneurotypical people have as much right to exist as you.
agreed 100% in your thinking. We are not there yet, simply put. So for now we have to live with the cards we are dealt. Aneurotypical people, have the same rights as we all do, and there should be no distinction, between mental illness, vs. physical illness. They are both diseases, so many are unfortunate to just get, through no fault of their own...that last phrase, sounds so retarded to me, but it needs to be said, as people seem to have this unique ability to blame other people for things they cannot help.
As to the longer term solution? Find a way to make human beings think better, with 100 times more emphasis on compassion, empathy, and just fucking caring for other humans. Unfortunately, I haven't figured this part out yet. heh
Yep, having been intimate with men resulting from the eugenics better known as 19th century Africans-to-Caucasians slavery, I find it nearly impossible to return to average westernised, medically kept alive men.
It's one thing to not have this intimate knowledge, but unfortunately, knowledge is not something that can simply be disregarded on a "humanitarian" bequest :(