This is a video about a blind person who was apparently able to see during her OBE and NDE.
It is a short video. Collected by Kenneth Ring, who advocates for souls, and afterlife. What do you think?
Note: people born blind at birth do not see in their dreams, so if this woman actually saw, it could mean something (maybe)
Can you yourself see any flaws in the premises or conclusion?
Could you guess what some of our responses might be?
My first instinct would be that anyone who was blind since birth would have no idea how anything looks, as even people given corneal grafts usually don't recognize things that they touched for a long period after they get their vision. I don't know how someone would even realize that they see themselves, or that they see birds or anything like that. I would be skeptical in that sense. If the lady did in fact see something, then I wouldn't know how to debunk that, as I know from studies that people who were born blind cannot see in dreams. They hear, touch etc. Therefore, if this woman really saw something, I wouldn't know how to explain it, and it could be a soul potentially.
some very strong points there. There is also the chance that the person has embellished her claim.
I think the others have given pretty good responses about the "soul" part.
Are people who are deaf capable of dreaminng about listening to Oasis? Are people who are colourblind dream about enjoying a Magritte painting? Are men capable of dreaming about giving painful birth?
The answer is yes. Does that mean their dream experience is sufficiently similar to the average experience of someone who can hear, see all colours or give birth? In some cases clearly no...in others we cannot know. Someone who has never had a specific sensory experience canot adequately describe it so that we can compare it with average experiences of the abled. It's even more difficult than you having to describe what seeing is to a blind person or what having an emotion is to an alien. How would you describe what emotions are to an alien incapable of them?
We cannot know what the experience the woman had was really like because she wouldn't be able to convey the experience sufficiently to compare it with the average experience of someone who can see. If the person has a sufficient understanding of their enviroment (through our many senses: sound, touch, smell, sense of ballance, sense of body placement, temperature etc) then they probably have at least a basic idea of what the structure of the room is and where and what some objects are that they may be able to give a superficial description of the room which makes it seem like they actually have seen when in reality the mind has filled in the blanks and got lucky with a couple details that were guess work. Still...she cannot relate her actual experience of seeing and it's extremely difficult to confirm that she actually saw. The details would have to be surprisingly accurate while describing extraordinary objects in the room which are impossible to guess.
The only way we could accept that she had an out of body experience is if we recreate the conditions of the experience (how could we?) in a highly controlled experiment and placed strange objects that are difficult to forget or not see around the room and have her describe all of them in detail. Then I think most of us would have our interest piqued. Otherwise the conclusion that her experience was real is too much. jumping to the conclusion that we have souls, as Strega and TJ noted...would be very far fetched.
You make some very strong points there. There have been recorded cases of people receiving corneal grafts, and not being able to identify objects that they used on a daily basis. Then, Kenneth Ring comes along and claims blind people can see during NDEs. He had about 20 cases, but his work seems like it could be biased. I think it makes far more logical sense to assume that they didn't actually "see". I guess you could say it is like a deaf person claiming that they could understand spoken language when they have never heard it.
I think you are onto something. And that something is nothing.
But i like your name. It is fun to rhyme.
This proves I got the soul to rock and roll!!!! Can I get an amen?
No, it proves people with brain waves are not dead.
People with stopped hearts and WITH brain waves hallucinate.
It has no evidence of souls any more than all of the OTHER NDE where NEAR is an important part of that.
Its just more woo, like the other woo you posted on the same lines.
A blind person SAYING "they saw" doesn't mean they saw, it can mean they thought they saw, as they imagined it would be like to see....but, we have zero confirmation that what she says she saw, was there...or, looked as she imagined it did.
All the OTHER NDE said they saw things, things we KNOW were not there when TESTED, such as tests where the ER had signs on top for them to see, if real...and ZERO people ever saw them, ALL reported seeing what they IMAGINED would be there...not what WAS there.
I can't argue with those points, they are good
Exactly, You hit the nail on the head. Plus it's not like the stories are consistent... I was in a garden, I was in a giant bubble, I saw an Indian goddess, My dead relatives were near me, etc., etc..
Also, since dying is a process, how do we know when these "events" supposedly happened on the near death timeline. I know when I am recovering from an ordinary illness such as the flu I have a period of euphoria when I turn the corner.