I was reading this blog article in HuffyPost from about 2 years ago. The author brings up a point where she says:
"While pro-choice legislation makes the rights of the mother clear, at what point is a father able to say,'I do not want this child'? Whether pro-life or pro-choice, we should all be able to agree that the quality of life is just as important as life itself, and when faced with the pivotal decision of whether or not to continue a pregnancy, both parents must be included in the dialogue. If not, ultimately, it is the child who suffers."
She goes on and provides data of situations of children growing in fatherless homes
• 63% of youth suicides are from fatherless homes
• 90% of all homeless and runaway children are from fatherless homes
• 85% of all children who show behavior disorders come from fatherless homes
• 80% of rapists with anger problems come from fatherless homes
• 71% of all high school dropouts come from fatherless homes
• 75% of all adolescent patients in chemical abuse centers come from fatherless homes
• 70% of youths in state-operated institutions come from fatherless homes.
• 85% of all youths in prison come from fatherless homes.
So undoubtedly the right for a woman to choose is obviously non negotiable. If a woman decides based on her situation that she does not want a child because of her reasoning, she has the right to abort her pregnancy without the approval of anyone other than herself. But the does the same rules apply for no one being able to endure a man to be financially responsible for a child that he did not want?
Another question to look at is if a man and woman have sex, they both know the consequences of a possible pregnancy. To which a woman can abort out of. But if a man and woman have sex, does the man have the right to have the woman to carry his child to term even the woman does not want to? (Talking about consensual sex, not rape or any of that stuff). Keep in mind that she knows the consequence of a possible pregnancy as well.
Keep in mind this is about a specific situation such as consensual sex not rape. Obviously matters of rape would nullify the discussion which I am aware of.
"both parents must be included in the dialogue. If not, ultimately, it is the child who suffers."
Not really - children don't need fathers - fathers are over rated. it only takes one good parent to raise a child or two. A good mother is better than the best father. The thing that will cause a child to suffer is if the mother is too young, not supported, living in poverty, uneducated etc.
"at what point is a father able to say,'I do not want this child'?"
. He doesn't have to want the child or see it. Thats his choice and he can piss off because a child with a good mother can do without its father. But the father still needs to pay to provide for its upbringing.
But if a man and woman have sex, does the man have the right to have the woman to carry his child to term even the woman does not want to?
No - can you imagine the horror of that reality. This is why its ultimately her decision. Its her body. How could a female possibly be forced to carry out a pregnancy to full term against her wishes? The living person is more important than the unborn non-person.
and with consensual sex - well how can we define consensual sex?
What if they were both drunk or one coerced the other or what if they were too young etc. Its not always rape. Sometimes its just a mistake and not convenient for her to be pregnant at that time.
Do men have the same problem?
Anyway Adam, what would you do If your condom broke and she became pregnant. Would you support the child even though you didn't want a relationship with it.
I'm not sure where you get your idea that the absence of dad is no big deal. From The Annals of Psychotherapy & Integrative Health.
A single parent, normally the mother, raises many of these children. Fatherless homes have a negative effect on children. According to the Center for Disease Control, 85% of all children that exhibit behavioral disorders come from fatherless homes (Center for Children’s Justice [CCJ], n.d.). The Bureau of the Census reports that 90% of homeless and runaway children are from fatherless homes (CCJ). Seventy-one percent of high school dropouts come from fatherless homes (CCJ). Seventy-five percent of all adolescent patients in chemical abuse centers come from fatherless homes (CCJ). Sixty-three percent of youth suicides are from fatherless homes (CCJ). Eighty percent of rapists motivated with displaced anger come from fatherless homes (Knight & Prentky, 1987). Eighty-five percent of all youths sitting in prison grew up in a fatherless home (CCJ). Criminal behavior experts and social scientists are finding intriguing evidence that the epidemic of youth violence and gangs is related to the breakdown of the two-parent family (CCJ). Additional statistics that emphasize the trauma of growing up in a fatherless home include the following:
5 times more likely to commit suicide
32 times more likely to run away
14 times more likely to commit rape
20 times more likely to have behavioral disorders
20 times more likely to end up in prison (Center for Children’s Justice)
"I'm not sure where you get your idea that the absence of dad is no big deal."
I'll always maintain that its the absence of community/culture thats caused the breakdown not the absence of bio-dad. I have no doubt that children need to grow up observing good role models in both sexes. Males can include elders, uncles etc not just dad.
and you know - about those statistics you've provided - those are caused by bad parenting and awful environments - not by the absence of dad.
You seem so sure that the mothers of all those at risk children don't have alternative male role models.
Where do you get that idea. Are mothers that dumb?
"Are mothers that dumb?"
The mainstream of them - yes
I have absolutely no sympathy for men who are irresponsible with their sperm. They need to deal with the consequences of that.
But where I do feel sorry for men is when they believe that the child or children they have been supporting for years, are not biologically theirs.
Thats a shocker.
I have absolutely no sympathy for women who are irresponsible with their eggs. They need to deal with the consequences of that.
See how rediculously sexist you sound when I swap the genders? I was expecting better than this from the TA gang.
"See how rediculously sexist you sound when I swap the genders?"
Its not sexist - women and men ARE NOT the same. women have a uterus - men do not.
Its not the same.
Well I always wanted to be a father, so I personally would support the child. But I can't speak for other men as I believe they should have a choice if they want to opt out, given the situation that both partners agree to take precautions against having a child prior to engaging in sexual activity.
I suppose then since no contraceptive is 100% acurate - the next question has to be asked.
What if? Then what?
and if she said that she would keep a baby if she accidentaly fell pregnant with you - and you wouldnt want her to - would you then not have sex with her at all?
Just in case.
Well you can reverse the question and say would she still have sex with me if I told her if she got accidentally pregnant, I want nothing to do with the baby? (Hypothetically speaking)
So I guess my answer would depend on the answer she gave me as well.
And if women never lied or changed their mind (a woman's prerogative, remember?) then you'd be safe.