In one of the interminable threads that devolved into endless discussions of pedophilia a couple of months ago, I raised an academic question about whether those who were commenting could come up with a reason why pedophilia was "wrong" without relying on a Judeo-Christian cultural context.   The history, I argued, was that in Greece and to a lesser extent in Rome, pedophilia in some forms was culturally acceptable; only those pesky Christians managed to radically change the culture.

For me it was just an academic speculation, but apparently I was much closer than I had ever considered possible.

http://www.salon.com/2013/09/10/richard_dawkins_defends_mild_pedoph...

In a recent interview with the Times magazine, Richard Dawkins attempted to defend what he called “mild pedophilia,” which, he says, he personally experienced as a young child and does not believe causes “lasting harm.”

Dawkins went on to say that one of his former school masters “pulled me on his knee and put his hand inside my shorts,” and that to condemn this “mild touching up” as sexual abuse today would somehow be unfair.

...

Child welfare experts responded to Dawkins’ remarks with outrage — and concern over their effect on survivors of abuse.

-------

I'm just curious what people think?   Even in the midst of the groping, fondling, and raping of kids, and hiding/covering up of the crimes which occurred among clergy of my faith, it was exceptionally rare that anyone actually tried to condone it as being harmless. 

Tags: Dawkins, Richard, pedophilia

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Why is that then, Mike?  Spell it out for me. 

Who are you to make such a demand? I've never known Pomeranians generally to be in a position to demand much of anything.

Angela hasn't swayed my opinion about your posts at all. They just tell me about her, not you. Your posts tell me about you!

I apologise to those reasonable folks who were offended by my outburst.

If you'll notice, Mike, my own rants, and yes, there are some, stop just short of what the "powers that be" could rightfully consider "personal attacks," which indeed are against the TOS rules. One of the moderators asked me last night what I thought, and I suggested a good night's sleep.

Maybe you phrased that middle paragraph a little thoughtlessly since one way to read it is that ML is a pedo. If that was not your intent, you might want to make that clear.

 

Well no I dont really think that Mike is a pedo but the beliefs kind of give me that - yuk you just crossed a line feeling.

and maybe I crossed a line too by my remarks.

Yeah, let's do that --

Child bride in Yemen dies of internal bleeding on wedding night: ac...

SANAA (Reuters) - An eight-year-old Yemeni girl died of internal bleeding on her wedding night after marrying a man five times her age, a social activist and two local residents said, in a case that has caused an outcry in the media and revived debate about child brides.

From an article:

"In other words, just because some people have come through sexual abuse with no more injuries than an “extremely unpleasant” memory doesn’t mean that childhood sexual abuse should be taken lightly. This isn’t simply a matter of a shifting moral climate that may well shift back again. We also know the damage isn’t just to the victim. While Dawkins was still at school, the master who molested him committed suicide."

http://ideas.time.com/2013/09/19/was-sex-with-children-ever-okay/?i...

I put way too much of my life out on this website, but since I have engaged in accusatory speech towards Catholics and clergy in general, I feel obligated to pass along  a situation that underlines the fact that pedophilia is not restricted to that population. I fear that it is even more common an occurance in the world than anyone would be comfortable with.

My uncle (on my mothers side) was just arrested yesterday in California for child molestation of his step-grandkids in Kansas. He is not affiliated with any religion that I know of, but tended so much towards hate speech in his online presence that I blocked him on my email and facebook several years ago.

Apparently the charge is inappropriate touching of 3 children (boys and a girl) between the ages of 8 and 14. He has admitted to the acts, but cites that the childrens parents "did not give them enough love. I gave them love". He is being extradited to Kansas sometime soon, and his offenses carry a possible life sentence. He is 68 years old.

Obviously, my family is in turmoil. This uncle was mostly distant from me. I never met his wife or her kids or grandkids. I do know him well enough to be shocked by all of this though. I would have never imagined that his eccentricity would take this type of a turn. Although I was active in the discussions on TA that Bob refers to in his Original Post over the last couple of months, I was totally unaware of this situation until yesterday.

My uncle moved in with my mom about 6 months ago because he was getting a divorce. (Apparently he also told my mom that he had molested his stepgrandkids, but she decided to keep it from the rest of the family) So that was why he was in California.

I, like most of you, probably would never think of a pedophiles life as being of interest, but since I am related to this one, I know lots about him. Some of it is weird.

  • He was born a hermaphrodite, but did not find out until about 5 years ago, when he was in a severe car accident and ended up in a hospital. The doctor asked his wife why he had suture marks between his anus and his scrotum. That is when he found out, his wife was the one who told him that he was born that way.
  • Like me, he grew up as a Christian Scientist. So he was not born in a hospital, and whoever did the surgery of his lady parts, It would have certainly been against church doctrine.
  • He worked for King Cash Register back in the 70's and 80's and was in charge of the working group that developed the scanning technology that is in wide use today at every grocery store.
  • He earned grants for solar technology inventions, and has several patents.
  • He is a cranky, republican asshole. 
  • He is otherwise a normal looking guy, although he sports really long hair for an older guy. He was also way into motorcycles and rarely owned a car in his life.
  • He wrote an inappropriate love letter to my sister (his neice) when she was 17. That was the only incident we knew of regarding his attraction to young people. And much of the reason I kept my distance from him all these years, as did much of the rest of my family.
  • His wife was a high school sweetheart, he went to prom with her. They lived long lives with other people and only reconnected about 8 years ago, and then married shortly after.

Regarding his actions, I feel sorrow for his wife and her family. It hurts my heart that I am related to someone who molested children. He deserves whatever punishment he gets, including whatever the prison population dishes out to him in Kansas. I think he is also probably mentally unstable or defective, but is still culpable for his crimes since he has been shown to be fully intelligent in so many other ways. He must have known what he was doing was wrong.

And for me, this was an indirect hit. I am far removed from the situation, just know of it more than anything else. I am one step closer than a person who would read about it in the newspaper.  I am disgusted, shocked, especially by his statements, and trying to be as much a support for the rest of my family as I can be from several states away. 

Thanks for listening/reading. A last reminder that pedophiles can be indistinguishable from everyone else. Teach your children to pay attention to their own radar. If someone seems strange to them, they should feel enpowered to be able to tell a trusted adult.

 

Thank you. Edifying. I have one point of disagreement - your final paragraph. No one should assume that a pedophyle will "seem strange". The one point I've offered on TA previously is this: Whatever is going on, the time for a young person to start telling a trusted adult is when an adult says, "don't tell anyone about this".

I don't think you are disagreeing, Mike, it looks more like fine-tuning to me, and a very good piece of advice indeed :)

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