ATHIEST vs AGNOSTIC - please read this. its why im here (sorta)...

I am not into any religions, and im also not an athiest. im AGNOSTIC. I want to learn here at thinkathiest. I always hear Athiests telling me 'youre almost there man, just come over!!!!! JUMP THAT FENCE!!!!" and I dont understand why. I dont know what happens when i die, so how can i say this is it. or there isnt anything else. I dont mean gods and heaven stuff. Im saying WHO KNOWS?!? To me an athiest is someone who believes there IS NO GOD. DONE DEAL. to me thats almost like believing in some higher power... thats why im so confused. what am i missing???? this is a serious question for ME. I guess ill say this. ok.. when we are talking about santa clause there isn't a group of people called 'something' who dont believe in santa. okk. there is no need for any word at all, but there is... atheists... or atheism... PLEASE DONT RESPOND TO THIS with the stuff about theists and non theists stuff unless necessary. im looking for an answer from someone like me who just has questions and want an answer like im talking to a friend, not the awesomest atheist in the village.. lol with all due respect. some Atheists are overbearing, although totally cool because youve obviously figured out that life is HERE and NOW and not waiting in some cloud with a bunch of virgins and bacon.. or whatever religious crap they spew. I LOVE Bill Mahr, Dawkins, Hitchens, Bill Nye, Neil Degrassi (i think its spelled right).

HOW CAN ATHIESTS SAY THERE IS NOTHING when NO ONE KNOWS?!?! Its the whole point! anyway, im new here so dont clobber me.. lol Thanks for reading this and responding.
(anyone can reply, i was just saying, im not an amateur and dont need the 101 on words that shouldn't even really exist... )


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I can't find myself on that scale. I call myself an agnostic atheist. In other words, I'm both. I don't believe God exists based on what I know, but I can't rule out that could change my mind, though I can't imagine what discovery or experience could accomplish that.

Being an atheist doesn't rule out the possibility that you could change your mind in the future. An atheist just doesn't believe in god now because there is no evidence now.

I'm Ignostic. I don't have any beliefs about the existence of god because any conversation about god or the supernatural is a waste of time. Ignostics believe that being 99% sure of god or 100% certain he doesn't exist is silly. It's like being 99% sure that Captain Picard and Harry Potter would get along swell. It's all nonsense. All of it. It's a little beside the point calling yourself an atheist or an agnostic in my opinion...because an opinion on an absurdity isn't an opinion worth bothering about in the first place.

Hey! Thanks for responding.. Yeah, I kinda hit on that earlier when I was referring to santa clause... There isn't a word for people who don't believe in Santa. That's kinda how I feel about this subject... I don't even like referring to myself as anything. Unfortunately at this point in 'time' humans are still dumbasses (pretty much). So until we are a global world and not all fighting over who's imaginary friend is better, I will be labeled. And I wear it proudly. Atheist - Agnostic .... Same page. Thank you so much. It isn't about maybe something is next, it's 'why would there be'? We have made it this far, why stop at agnostic.. Just jump over and accept what you already believe. Logic. Physics.
Davis. Thank you. I think you have hit it on the head... .i agree... 99%-100%... Ok.

-ryan beatty

I think you hit it, Davis. And Captain Kirk would get along better with Harry Potter, I think.

Hmmm. The question is if there was a battle royale between Potter, Kirk and Picard with no rules and gloves off...who would win? Keep in mind there is only one objectively true answer and if you are lucky and have enough money I will tell you over the phone what the answer is and for a lot more you can by my special book which is a cosmic revalation of these deep truths.

Anti-theist: Believes there is no god.
Atheist: Does not believe in god.
Agnostic: Believes it equally possible that there is a god or not.

It makes no sense to believe something without evidence.
There can be no evidence to disprove the existence of god.
It makes no sense to be an anti-theist.

It makes no sense to believe something without evidence.
There is no evidence to prove the existence of any god.
It makes no sense to be a theist.

That leaves atheism.

I don't believe it is equally likely that there is no evidence for god because either
a) there is no god to leave evidence
b) god has deliberately erased all evidence of his existence

a) is the most likely explanation, so that rules out agnosticism.

Hence I am an atheist with no agnostic tendencies.


I find this narrative helps explain agnostice: One cannot prove god doesn't exist and there is no evidence that he does and so I am fence sitting.

That doesn't mean that they believe that god's existence or non-existence is equally probable. Agnostics can (and usually do) have very serious doubts about god's existence and think it far more probable that god doesn't exist.

Where did you get this definition of agnostics Shane?

Atheism and agnosticism are not mutually exclusive in the same way atheism and theism are. You say there is no evidence that god exists, and I'm going to guess you don't believe things without evidence, so I would say you are an atheist. The 'a' means non, so if you aren't a theist you are an atheist by default.

'Gnosis' was used by the early Christian Church to mean 'spiritual knowledge' derived from the Greek word for knowledge. Thomas Huxley coined the word agnostic to mean without spiritual knowledge. Personally I agree with Christopher Hitchens when he says the term is pretty meaningless or even adds to the confusion. But it can be used in conjunction with both theism (or more probably deism) and atheism as a descriptor.

Agnostic deist: doesn't claim to know if there is a god but believes in one
Agnostic atheist: doesn't claim to know that there isn't a god but doesn't believe in one
A true agnostic believes either is equally likely.

IMO adding agnostic doesn't add much to the description of a theist and is redundant when added to the term of atheist, but is sometimes used to highlight the difference to the term anti-theist.

Another way to think about it is the use of the 7 step scale that Dawkins suggested. The specific descriptions of belief are mine.

1. Theist
2. Deist
3. Agnostic Deist
4. Agnostic
5. Agnostic atheist
6. Atheist
7. Anti-theist


Well... you could be a theist and an anti-theist at the same time.  If God came down and revealed himself/herself to us... oh... for shits and giggles lets just say its the Mormon god... Joseph Smith is there with a big smile on his face saying... see, I told you so.  And he really reveals himself to everyone with 100% certainty - beyond a reasonable doubt...Well we would all be theist.  There would be no atheist..(except for the few who refuse to except reality).  But I'm pretty sure we would still all be opposed to this lunatic God...because you know... he is a total asshole... we would not worship him... we would not bow down...we would be anti-theist.

thats not what anti-theist means.

Wow Shane. That is EXACTLY what I wanted to know. You really cleared things up for me. Thank you.

THANK YOU TO EVERYONE. This has been sooo helpful. Wow.

I am an Atheist.

I see CLEARLY why atheists would say "you're almost there buddy... Just walk on over, the doors open"

It really bothered me because I always felt like I was missing something... Shane, I'll remember this post for the rest of my life. That's pretty cool shit. It's amazing how places like this and Facebook can allow people who've never met actually have such an impact on someone's life. I admit, it was a nice stroll through the garden to get from agnostic to atheist. When I went from Methodist to agnostic, that was an amazing moment. It was like the opposite of Pandora's box. It was like a clear light of reality and life changing. But don't worry Shane, this is important too. And it will being easier to just say atheist instead of always explains agnostic,


-ryan beatty



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