My statement was only to prove that there was a "lowest common denominator" for a non-subjective morality without god.
Though interestingly enough there are plenty of subjective moralities with god..eh?
Because then they would have to take responsibility for their own decisions and actions. Anything can be justified or rationalized if "god gave you strength to do it" or if you "fell to sin because you're human and weak"
Religious morality is nothing more than a well-she-was-wearing-the-mini-skirt-so-she-was-asking-to-be-raped defense.
It takes the responsibility of right and wrong off of a persons shoulders. Even sadder still, it attributes all the good, right, caring, compassionate works to some deity that had nothing to do with the life struggle, realizations and hard work of those that sacrifice a whole lot just to do a little good.
It doesn't give credit where credit is due, and it neutralizes consequences where responsibility should be fessed up.
Isn't that a lovely state? All nice, secure and comforting?
< /rant >
(can you tell my ex is in town? sheesh, even I feel bitchy for posting that!)
I have found that my moral view point has grown stronger in alot of ways now that I no longer have the "gOd" influence. I see people as people instead of "sinners" and "saints". I see the crimes and just outright murders that are commited in the name of whatever gOd people who commit them are worshipping. I also found myself mental and emotional freedom that i didnt have as I would think before that i was beign sinfull in thinking some things...
Should Atheism really have a particular moral framework? I'm a utilitarian (as my pseudonym would suggest). But I cannot say that all Atheists subscribe to utilitarianism. Could we not just acknowledge that Atheism frees us to explore rational moral frameworks?
You can... right up until a theist asks (and believe me, they always do) "how do you know right and wrong without God to tell you?"
Basically one of the biggest arguments that theists have against atheists is that without a deity we have no moral compass,
To that argument I would hope that we reply by saying exactly where our morals come from. I get my morals from reason, my upbringing, my evolutionary instincts, my deeply entrenched love for humanity. my belief that moral laws are a natural extension of physical laws, and my desire to live in society with friends.
Not from a 2000 year old book that sanctions men to sell their daughters into slavery.
Then I would ask this Theist how I could trust him to make the right moral choices when he believes in such unambiguously immoral teachings, and fantastical space-gods.
I'm worried that if we start attaching too many other views and implications to Atheism then it would eventually be seen as a doctrine itself, and we would lose the necessary diversity.
I pointed out to one person who asked me that that expecting all atheists to have the same ethical code because we are all atheists would be like expecting all theists to have the same code because they are all theists. So his (Baptist) should be the same as a Hindu, a Muslim, a Catholic, etc. I think the Catholic one irked him the most.
Precisely, Rene. Atheism is simply the lack of a belief in a deity. That's it. Different atheists can have different ethical systems. Utilitarianism, objectivism, secular humanism, naturalistic materialism, and so forth.