I just left a group I joined a few weeks ago as I  have contributed not a sausage. I dont actually know why I joined as I am not against liberals or some liberal policy's

My leaning are socialist in nature barr a few right wing views which you could count on one hand.

My main  gripes are with religon, passive atheists, agnostic  sit on the fence lovlies and Glasgow celtic fans.

thats that then

i was listening the radiohead song creep

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFkzRNyygfk

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I just can;t help diving into that whole "agnostic versus atheist" discussion. I really find "agnostic" to be useless in most circumstances.
i do not see it having any value, nonw what so ever, however I am open to new ideas



sleep well friend
Well, I certainly have no belief, so that throws me due west.
Gnostic/agnostic is not certainty, as i see it, but rather knowledge. If you claim to know something, you are gnostic, and should be able to provide evidence supporting that claim of knowledge.
Then absolutely knowing something is not certainty? I considered them pretty much the same. There seems to be a disconnect between that use of gnostic and the common use of many the word agnostic. Otherwise, agnostic and ignorant would be synonyms.

Good old Merriam says thia about agnostic:

1 : a person who holds the view that any ultimate reality (as God) is unknown and probably unknowable; broadly : one who is not committed to believing in either the existence or the nonexistence of God or a god
2 : a person unwilling to commit to an opinion about something


And I think there are many agnostics that fit both definitions. But the more I read the first definition, the more problems I have with it, as I do with many definitions of the word "atheism".

By this definition, I would not consider myself an agnostic at all. I agree with the first half of the first definition, although I see that being just as irrelevant as never being able to disprove the existence of fairies or proving any number of negatives. Which loops back to my disagreement over labeling my unbelief in all sorts of crazy things with the elegant but fun word "agnostic".

Of course, gnostic refers to adherents of gnosticism, according to Merriam, which says this on gnosticism:

: the thought and practice especially of various cults of late pre-Christian and early Christian centuries distinguished by the conviction that matter is evil and that emancipation comes through gnosis

And gnosis is:

: esoteric knowledge of spiritual truth held by the ancient Gnostics to be essential to salvation.

So it looks to me like, according to Merriam, that gnostic and agnostic are not even antonyms of each other, really.
tell me about this doone,
cheers for the kind words, i was expecting a busy time
i have seen a darker side to you now neal man, its worrying
Here is the broken link now fixed for the celtic fans, just for doone. hehe

http://img29.picoodle.com/img/img29/9/9/20/f_celtic20fanm_37e142a.jpg

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