The point of this discussion is to get people’s perspective on abortion. Why people do it. And why people are against it.
From Catholic.org I found a video on abortion, but it didn’t look like the normal procedures performed in the United States. It looks like they purposely chose the worst pictures possible to convince Christians that abortion is wrong. Where did they get such graphic material?
Video Link: http://www.catholic.org/video/watch.php?v=13
A legal abortion in the United States looks more like this: http://www.thisismyabortion.com
I believe if you get pregnant by accident that you should keep it. But if you are forced (rape) (incest) then it definitely changes things. How can we force her to bring a rapist’s baby to term? I also heard that giving birth to a rapist’s baby is like being raped all over again.
I think that making abortion illegal is wrong. This takes away women’s rights. I believe women should choose, but I think it’s recommended that women take counseling before taking any action.
This is my opinion, but I would like to know others point of view on the subject.
I got two questions for you:
Thank you for answering respectfully.
Atheism will not give you any value, male or female, only remove the distraction of religion.
As for abortion, the only thing being an atheist will yield is that you may take a decision to keep or abort a pregnancy based on your personal thoughts (or feelings, if you are thoughtless). Presumably you would, as a woman, clap on brave young men facing dismemberment or death to protect you if war was on your doorstep, yet you quibble over the rights over something/someone which has yet to see the light of day.
I have seen both types of images (such as you put the links to). Both of them are valid images. All you have to do is take a look at fetal development from conception to 9 months. The one image you showed was a very early, probably suction abortion. The fetus was very small and probably basically torn into very small pieces by the suction. The other images are of older fetuses. A lot of these also happen in the US. The fetus by five months looks just like a fully formed, very small newborn. I looked up the statistics: 1.5 % of abortions occur after the 21 week period in the US. That might not seem like much, but do the math of 1.5 % out of 1.2 million and that's plenty enough to make these valid images from the US. They throw them out with the medical waste, or someone in the clinic could photograph them. So yes, they are real.
So, Gina, a legal abortion looks like both of these. I think it would be dishonest to deny either one or the other, because both are true.
In most states, and the UK it's illegal to get an abortion after 24 weeks. At 24 weeks a fetus is a little over 10 inches long. Some of those fetuses were much bigger. That's why I doubted that some of those images came from legal abortions.
And anyways, why would you abort a pregnancy so close to being done? It's kinda pointless. And even with medical reasons, if she can make it to 6 months, then why can't she bring the baby to term?
The reason why it's illegal after 24 weeks is because the fetus can feel pain in the 6th month of gestation. You're basically hurting another being when performing an abortion after 24 weeks. "Fetuses cannot feel pain until at least the 28th week of gestation because they haven't formed the necessary nerve pathways." - http://m.discovermagazine.com/2005/dec/fetus-feel-pain
You will find other information that says the fetus can feel pain starting from the 24th week. - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neonatal_perception
I'm neither pro-life OR pro-choice. It the woman's body... let HER make the decision...
It the woman's body... let HER make the decision...
uh.. that's what pro-choice means man
I am generally not against the taking of life for good reason as long as individual humans remain expendable, and find the stretching the concept of life to include a somewhat developed zygote to be tenuous at best.
its like this, the woman should have the say so because it is her body. the end.
First... Gina... if you believe that abortion is wrong but should be a choice... then you are pro-choice. Pro-life is a bit of a misnomer. The abortion battle is solely over the LEGALITY of abortion. Pro-life should actually be called "anti-choice" because the position of "pro-life" is that it should be illegal in most (or all) cases for women to get an abortion.... which has nothing to do with whether abortion is right or wrong. Second, the catholic "abortion" video is disgusting and misleading. The fetus in the video is clearly far too developed to be a legal abortion. This may be a back-alley abortion in another country.
Secondly, there are anti-choice non-theists... but their logic is flawed. This particular article outlines exactly how they are still influenced by the vestige of religion in their mind when thinking about abortion.
The true question is this... and it is very simple: Do you think that abortion should be illegal?
Yes? You are "pro-life" (anti-choice)
No? You are pro-choice.
Morality is not the main decider of whether one is pro-life or pro-choice.
My religious mother thought she was pro-life until I asked her whether she thought that abortion should be outlawed. When she said no... I said... "I have news for you mom... you are pro-choice. You think abortion is wrong... but then again, most pro-choicers don't think it's a good thing either. But you don't think that it should be illegal- ergo, you are pro-choice by default."
This is a false choice. Everyone is pro-life. I think that women have the right to control their bodies and not have unwanted children. Those calling themselves pro-life are really anti-choice. I am pro-choice.
I think abortion is okay. I am not against it. George Carlin actually has a brilliant video on YouTube about this topic, go check it out! I think nobody says it better than him. I used to be against abortion when I was a teenager, but I think that every woman has a choice to do it or not. If you do not have the means to provide for the child, then why have a baby? And in cases like rape etc, i am totally for it. The world has 7 billion people on it, abortion of fetuses will not make that number go down. And abortion must be done within 8 weeks. In cases where mothers get an abortion after 7 months, mmm.., I dont support because then the fetus have developed too much and has all the features of a baby...