In this discussion I would like to talk about abortion. It is always something I have felt very strong about and would argue to the ends of the earth on. I have always been Pro-Life, always. Ever since I became an Atheist, this topic keeps popping up in my head. Since it is something I have not wanted to confront, I have been pushing it to the back burner. Now that I have given it some thought I would like to tell you where I used to stand and where I stand now. When I was a Christian my thought process was "Abortion is Never the right choice unless the mother and child will both die." So even if the child were to survive and the mother dies, abortion is still not the right choice. Some might even consider that murder, I guess. To answer this question I'm sure someone will ask, Yes I would have and still would give up my life for my child. Well, now I'm sort of seeing things a bit different. If a female gets raped and gets pregnant from it, abortion is ok, (sad all the way around - for everyone).  If a woman chooses to abort a baby due to the risk to the mothers life, Ok. If the baby will have a very very very difficult life and in turn make the parents have an equally difficult life, ok. To me abortion is a horrible thing, if someone wants to have an abortion just because oops I got preggo. That is horrible. If you don't want kids do everything in your power to NOT get pregnant. Simple as that. Life is a beautiful an precious thing, and yes I do believe it is special.  Any and All comments are welcome :)

Tags: abortion, pro-choice, pro-life

Views: 3670

Reply to This

Replies to This Discussion

Thanks, I spent the morning watching a documentary about Hans Rosling. His personal story is compelling, but the documentary was just ok. 

I agree, last year when I watched the TED talk I was so infuriated by his lack of scientific thoroughness that I wrote him a two-page correspondence. He did have the decency to respond to me.

The largest mistake made by a great many people discussing population is comparing modern procreation trends to historical ones... but completely missing the point of the definition of historical. Typically, people talk about reduced breeding effort in terms of the 1950s. The surrounding years saw the largest ever breeding effort by any women anywhere on the planet. When doing statistical analyses, we must not compare the present to the very worst period in history, that is an extremely poor strategy. We must use a reasonable baseline. The challenge is therefore to evaluate the breeding success of females through the centuries, hopefully going back at least a couple of thousand years.

Can you imagine a society where the idea of pro-life is a thinly-veiled scheme to keep enlistment in the christian army at high levels so that they can dominate everyone and everything else and win the ultimate battle of good and evil with all the other heathens?

I can. Wait, that's not my imagination, that's our reality.

Marc

I do agree that human beings are a scourge on the planet. How could any sane person think otherwise? I was thinking about the idea to put a moratorium on procreation for fifty years, and I think very few people would still be able to have kids when it was finished.
I wonder how much of my opinions or feelings about what is right and wrong are just products of my upbringing, experiences, etc. if I am not brainwashed just as much as any religious person in many ways. And I'm not a biologist, I'm in healthcare, so that biases me towards sick people in some ways, because that's who I'm meant to care for as my job. But I am sick about the harm done to the planet, and the terrible destruction people, including myself, have done.
Do you think disease will wipe us out, or control the population in a way that is more manageable or are we truly destined for the cannibalistic horror show that kris describes? Thanks T a a for the cute pics.
Here's two of my kids, both adopted, even though they look related.
Attachments:

cute pets :)
Funny about the healthcare thing, I have a this funny opinion that people in healthcare are the most marriageable people around, since they are the most empathetic, the most compassionate, and the most driven to save lives at all costs. Of course I don't really associate with those qualities, and I am happily bachelor... :)

A vast majority of people on this site have only let go of supernatural in the last few years, some here STILL have not let go of all supernatural. Everything that is modern human is learned. It is the reason our society is so dysfunctional. The very people, such as yourself, who's life purpose is to ensure the earth has the most humans possible, through eschewing death as often and long as possible, are the very source of our dysfunctional humans... sorry, I don't mean this personally, but to all people in healthcare. In a regular biologically driven species, unfit individuals would not survive to procreate. We have skewed this, ensuring that all individuals get their "chance" to breed. You could compare it to salmon farming. Salmon farming is the death of the wild population of salmon, because of all the defective babies that grow to adulthood, spreading disease throughout the wild populations, breeding defective genetic makeups into the general population. This is what pharmaceutical companies are banking on, the more defective genes get to procreate, the more clients the pharmaceutical industry has. It's a wonderful business plan, more sick people, more income, and so on and so on.


It is the ultimate demonstration of the Law of Unintended consequences... good intentions creating bad results. "Good" is often not "good". It's why I dislike concepts of good and bad, they're entirely subjective, to the person who stands to benefit from it.

Strega, that was a great post, and you brought up a really good point. This idea that contraception is murder, and that people are opposed to someone using it has often boggled my mind. I cannot wrap my head around it, but some of the stuff that someone was saying about Islam made me think maybe it's a way to make soldiers for "gods army". I've heard that expression used, and thought they meant it as a metaphor, but maybe the goal is that if you have the
majority of people who think the same, you can wipe out the rest, is this maybe a secret goal of the Christian church? One of my friends was complaining about the sex Ed in schools, and how they're teaching them about masturbation and how awful she thought that was. Then she went on to say that only abstinence prevents pregnancy and disease, she seemed to completely overlook the fact that masturbators cannot infect themselves... Well I guess they could if they did ass to ewwwww..... Icky poo. Sex is gross. Why do religions have such a hard time around human sexuality? Why did they come up with this idea that god hates sex unless its for procreation? And now I have to come up with a new set of rules or good and evil... Well, I still don't want to hurt anyone, or myself, and I'd like to make a difference in the world, and have a bit of fun...maybe I don't have to change too much! Thanks everyone for making me think! And sorry for being icky, I'm only human ;)

I share many of the views of George Carlin's, specially when talking about the sanctity of life. You said that "life is a beautiful and precious thing," I warrant you that it isn't for those children dying of hunger. Life is Life, whether it's beautiful or not is all about where you are standing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AvF1Q3UidWM

Consider this, when it comes to abortion we only care about OUR own species. We don't think twice about the chicken eggs we eat (those are fertilize eggs too).

Women should have the right to carry an early abortion for any reason. Yet, I do not endorse abortions as substitutes for birth control. Abortions should be performed at any point of the pregnancy if the life of the mother is endangered. Abortions should be performed if a woman gets pregnant because of a rape. Abortions should be performed if the child is not likely to have a normal life, and if the parent(s) choose to do so.

Try thinking of life and abortion in objective ways, without adding any emotional baggage. After we all get that down, lets get down to care for the people who's already here, instead of those who don't exist and might never do so.

I agree with all you say; however, it misses the REAL point of the "pro-life" agenda.  It is NOT about reverence for life; if it were, these people would oppose the death penalty and wars, but they don't; in fact, they tend to embrace both wholeheartedly.  At its core, it is about the male domination many insecure men (and their obedient wives) see as being  endorsed in the Bible.  As I said, I agree with you, but it's a moot point, because it should not be MY decision, it should be YOURS and that of all women who face the agonizing choice.

You know one day, it would be really gratifying to walk into a "pro-life" abortion-banning, contraception-banning meeting, and announce:-

"You know what?  You're right!  Women can't interfere with the fertilised zygote!  At any stage! Absolutely right..... So obviously, we must insist that all men have vasectomies!"

Now that we have artificial insemination sorted, we really don't need pregnancy from sex.  Just have a bit of sperm frozen with your name on it, and line up here for the little snip.

Problem?

"Problem?"

Yes, I can't write my name legibly that small.

No miniature calligraphy skills?  Oh dear, we won't be needing your genes in the pool!

That's alright. I was planning on having robots instead of babies anyway.

RSS

Services we love!

We are in love with our Amazon

Book Store!

Gadget Nerd? Check out Giz Gad!

Advertise with ThinkAtheist.com

In need a of a professional web site? Check out the good folks at Clear Space Media

© 2014   Created by umar.

Badges  |  Report an Issue  |  Terms of Service